1tsotsi

I just like the headline that says; THE LAST WHITE SOUTH AFRICAN PRESIDENT.
Report Abuse

cornelius

As usual, words and their intent are being twisted. The man clearly apologised for apartheid and called it morally repugnant. HOW IS THAT TO BE SEEN AS " DEFENDING APARTHEID", MS MTHEMBU ????

What he was probably saying was something a lot of people are beginning to think, nl that b.lack and w.hite can never live peacefully together, and that the original idea of separate nation states maybe was not a bad idea - if it was implemented fairly, i.e. a b.lack state with the majority of the land, and a wh.te ( and coloured) state with the ( smaller) portions of the land that was not originally traditionally in b.lack hands ( nl the Western Cape) .
Report Abuse

RobinH

If it was indeed a "mistake" it was a very dof one. Meneer de Klerk. DINK OUTOPPIE. MOENIE VIR JOU ONNOSEL HOU NIE! Dis ons land wat jy met jou onnosele woorde bedonner. Jou tyd is verby. Bly nou stil.
Report Abuse

Tasto

Thank you Sowetan, at last.White racism is not an accident from their leaders Zille,De Klerk down to Stevehofmeyer,JDosSantos,RDeSa,Robinh of this world resort in EC, Hoerskool in NW list is endless !!

Wow , this is the first time to read\hear tha Mandela regretted calling De kler "man of integrity" !!

DeKlerk call NMandela his friend WOW !! All white ppl can't stand black ppl unless we can be like NMandela !!
Report Abuse

Tasto

Ediotor jou moer !! Why ??
Report Abuse

TKay

Thanks to that model Dos Santos we are having all these debates, she must be proud of herself
Report Abuse

MGEEZ

I actually watched this interview yesterday evening on CNN and i must say that i was shcoked to say the least Whilst his interview should give us insight into our realities, it was nevertheless still a revelation for me!!!
Report Abuse

MommaC

"There are three reasons it (apartheid) failed," he said. "It failed because the whiites wanted to keep too much land for themselves. It failed because we (whiites and bIacks) became economically integrated, and it failed because the majority of bIacks said that is not how we want our rights."

Here's a question. If white people had kept to an area of (for example) Swaziland and left the rest of the country alone, would we have the problems we have today?
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

TASTO

And all black people dont like white people unless they the coach of kaiser Chiefs
Report Abuse

RobinH

MommaC: Not discussion I even want to entertain. I live in Cape Town and no-one will ever force me to move. Not what the struggle was fought for, so no go. Not even hypothetically.
Report Abuse

MGEEZ

MommaC
"There are three reasons it (apartheid) failed," he said. "It failed because the whiites wanted to keep too much land for themselves. It failed because we (whiites and bIacks) became economically integrated, and it failed because the majority of bIacks said that is not how we want our rights."

Here's a question. If white people had kept to an area of (for example) Swaziland and left the rest of the country alone, would we have the problems we have today?
============================================================================
Hypothetically speaking, NO; but we know why they chose RSA and not Swaziland!!! And if the were given an opportunity to do it all over again; they will still chose RSA!!!
Report Abuse

Tasto

@JajazQueen - I can't just forget u few weeks back trying to drum into your head that Bantustan Homelands\Apartheid were evil you the only black that saw some beauty in it bcause dar.kkies knew how to behave when to move out of the opavement when white person is coming !!

Report Abuse

MommaC

MGEEZ

That isn't hypothetically speaking. That is ignoring the question.
I didn't say IN Swaziland, I said the approximate AREA of Swaziland.

What I'm actually asking is if the original concept of 'living apart' was wrong or if the greed of wanting all the assets was wrong? Whilst those kooks in Oranja are a joke, nobody really objects to them having their own little 'bantustan'. Why? Is it because it is a reasonably small area and they don't bother anyone else?
Report Abuse

Ntebaleng

not supprised that coming from De klerk , did
Report Abuse

MommaC

RobinH

I'm not talking about NOW. I'm asking about what would have happened if we had never left the Cape in the first place. i.e if the Voortrekkers had not happened
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

MommaC

There would still just be mud huts everywhere and no infrastructure or civilisation
Report Abuse

MommaC

DA-DBN-GUY

How can you be sure of that?
There is also much to be said of the humble mudhut. They are cooI in summer and warm in winter as well as being environmentally friendly. The various sites around suggest that stone storage and rudimentary irrigation schemes were in place. What is to say that the progression wouldn't have continued?

My question is not about what the infrastructure would be but rather what the race relations would be. I.E was the concept the problem or the rampant greed of one of the races involved?
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@DA-DBN-GUY
Does it eva occur to you that it is your kind they h.ate?

Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

One only has to look at the rest of this continent and those off the continent that are run by black leaders, that a black man cannot govern a country. He is only driven by greed and crime. He rapes the environment, steals from the people and destroys infrastructure. He has no planning for the future skills, more or less uneducated but popular with a certain ethnic group and he will usually live in the lap of luxury while the rest of his people in squalor. Sound familiar?
Report Abuse

Hoshpelepelewa26Zikuphi

"It failed because the wh1tes wanted to keep too much land for themselves
===============================================================
Lets then keep the land to us.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@DA-DBN-GUY
You can only see such things when you think with your skin. As far as I know, there's always the corruptor who come in a form of foreign investors, and they don't usually come from the African states.
Report Abuse

Doritos

@DA-DBN-GUY

Simply making assumptions that Africa is in it's state because "the black man can't govern a country" just shows how ignorant you are. Do yourself a favor and educate yourself because you are making all us white people look like ignorant racists. There are lots of influences that made Africa what it is today. Do yourself a favour and read up on it. You have a very distorted image of white people in this country. Look around you, they are far from perfect.

People like DA-DBN-GUY and black people that think like him are what hinders this country to go forward in my opinion. The past should be left in the past cause there is nothing we can do about it now. We can only move forward and the only way we can do that is by accepting each other and start changing for the better!
Report Abuse

cornelius

RobinH,seperate states is not first option for me either, but if my children are going to be discriminated against and have to listen to their own government singing songs calling for them to be ki.lled for the rest of their lives, the point is reached where one thinks maybe its the only option.
Report Abuse

MommaC

DA-DBN-GUY

Yes, The African continent went through a string of really really bad despot leaders. The trend is reversing though.

If you look at Botswana and Namibia then your case is one of selective reporting. Nigeria (for all its faults) is still outdoing us on the financial front. The great Ms Sirleaf Johnson may not be a saint but she has worked complete miracles in Liberia. Even Kenya and Tanzania seem to be getting their acts together (despite the religious fruitcakes and pirates).
Report Abuse

RobinH

sarajevo, sudan, mali..... need I say more. Separatism is not the way to go, simply because humans have not yet learned to deal with difference in an acceptable way. We need to evolve!
Report Abuse

Budapat

Last White South African President, grand sharp FW de Klerk must just SHUT THE F U C K UP!!
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

DA-DBN-GUY
One only has to look at the rest of this continent and those off the continent that are run by black leaders, that a black man cannot govern a country. He is only driven by greed and crime. He rapes the environment, steals from the people and destroys infrastructure. He has no planning for the future skills, more or less uneducated but popular with a certain ethnic group and he will usually live in the lap of luxury while the rest of his people in squalor. Sound familiar?
===============================================================================

You are highly uneducated!!!!

But i would swear that you are probably an ANC supporter posing as a DA supporter trying to undermine the perception of DA supporters.

To Sowetan -> Please ban this irk!
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

MommaC

But that was after they ousted their colonial "masters" and after how many years before they started to come right? Nigeria has oil fields which will of course help them out. But why so many Nigerians in SA? A better life perhaps or is it a safe haven for the drug dealers?

How many of these countries were never under colonial rule, the same rule that brought the infrastructure to produce and extract the minerals, roads, railway etc etc?
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Guys De Klerk said that noone can defend apartheid............spot on!

With regards to the homelands...........perhaps he created room for his views to be misinterpreted..............in which, he would of being better off had he never mentioned anything about the homelands.

But give the guy a break.
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

The-Rothschilds

Please elaborate as to why you say i am uneducated? And please prove me wrong in my statement if you can.
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

DA-DBN-GUY
MommaC

But that was after they ousted their colonial "masters" and after how many years before they started to come right? Nigeria has oil fields which will of course help them out. But why so many Nigerians in SA? A better life perhaps or is it a safe haven for the drug dealers?

How many of these countries were never under colonial rule, the same rule that brought the infrastructure to produce and extract the minerals, roads, railway etc etc?
=============================================================================

Has it ever crossed your mind that Africans were maybe better off in the wild, rather than an polluting greedy industrial world.

Have you ever heard the term.............what you dont know, cannot harm you?

You are a sick racist.

Please Sowetan -> BAN THIS DOUCHE BAG!
Report Abuse

RobinH

Rothschilds: That is semantics. Throughout the entire Verwoerd era, the Broeders and their cronies kept insisting that apartheid was merely "separate development" and actually implied "separate but equal". This is patent fact. We lived with it on virtually every day's radio propaganda. Let's not go there, really. The homelands were simply a way of shifting the oppressed out of sight and thus (hopefully) out of mind.
Report Abuse

Doritos

@DA-DBN-GUY

Because your narrow minded views follow the old pattern that Africa is in this state only because of skin colour and race and that "white" people came and saved everything (which is so ironic). There is so much more, google it and read a few books, educate yourself.
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

DA-DBN-GUY
The-Rothschilds

Please elaborate as to why you say i am uneducated? And please prove me wrong in my statement if you can.
===============================================================================

Africans had some sort of peace and sustainability until European invasion.

How do you think Africans survived for 1000s of years before any foreigners set foot here? Yes, there never had cars, hospitals etc but what they had was in actual fact more sustainable than the industrial world that Europe created.

Colonialism allowed monsters like Mugabe, to manifest and take over Africa...........Mugabe is a product of colonialism. His hatred derives from the horrors himself and his people experienced under colonial rule.
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

The-Rothschilds

"Has it ever crossed your mind that Africans were maybe better off in the wild"

and this phrase doesnt make you a racist or a biggot yourself? Please you still have not proved me wrong in my statement Mr Sympathizer.

Obviously your lack of education wont harm you either then!

Please ban yourself!
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ MGEEZ. At that time there was not even such a thing as an RSA. No country or state, no borders, infrastructure. That was all put in place by the evil w.hite man.
Report Abuse

MommaC

DA-DBN-GUY

Infrastructure has a rather limited lifespan. The only roads or sewage works that held together for very long were the Roman ones and the Romans weren't in Nigeria (to the best of my knowledge).

I was actually stunned at how loved Idi Amin still is in parts of Uganda. The sod may have been as crazy as a box of spiders but he DID take infrastructure into the rural areas. The, now permanently retired, Gaddaffi also brought a hell of a lot of good before the Brother Leader completely lost his marbles. Banda of Malawi may have kept his people as backward as possible but he did eradicate tribal issues ........ you see, looking at the end is not seeing the whole
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

RobinH
Rothschilds: That is semantics. Throughout the entire Verwoerd era, the Broeders and their cronies kept insisting that apartheid was merely "separate development" and actually implied "separate but equal". This is patent fact. We lived with it on virtually every day's radio propaganda. Let's not go there, really. The homelands were simply a way of shifting the oppressed out of sight and thus (hopefully) out of mind.
==============================================================================

points taken
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ MommaC and RobinH, just a last point from me : if you allow yourself to be trampled upon, you will be trampled upon. Wh.ite people should not just accept that they and their children will be discriminated against and insulted, because of the colour of their skins for ever. Look at the smugness with which tsotsi 1 revels in the fact that no w.hite person can ever become the president of this supposedly non racial country again. We all know its true, and in fact the same applies to a " coloured" person, whether you are a struggle stalwart like Willie Hofmeyer and Trevor Manuel or not. Anti whi.te racism has become entrenched and acceptable in our country.
Report Abuse

DA-DBN-GUY

The-Rothschilds

"Africans had some sort of peace and sustainability until European invasion"

Are you for real? What of the barbarism inflicted by the Shaka and kie on their enemies? Or even the wars between clans in Zimbabwe before the colonialists even set foot there? Or the Congo for that matter. Surely the likes of Mugabe would then do MORE for his people considering he grew up under colonial rule? Hiding behind colonial rule is a total cop out and unjustifiable
Report Abuse

sowhatif

Ahh,stupid article ...mxm
Report Abuse

MommaC

cornelius

I allow nobody to 'trample on' me.
Just maybe if my people didn't do so much trampling then nobody would even consider trampling on us? Face it. We made it about colour schemes. We can hardly cry about it now simply because the sh0es have swapped feet. I'm not defending the baby Tsotsi but we haven't really done much to change his views.
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ The- Rothschilds. To be exact, if you have not heard of the Mfecane wars, please google.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@DA-DBN-GUY
Your father robbed you of your freedom to think and make your own judgements. But growing up in a farm, not socializing, and moaning all day about how you were robbed can really mess your brain, find yourself a girlfriend, that might help.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@cornelius
Europeans decided to end wars amongst themselves(their Mfecanes) and attack other races, hence they oppressed every other race.
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

DA-DBN-GUY

Study African history please..........you a waste of space on this blog
Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

Ja. History ain't your strong point
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Sjekula

It is war in Europe that caused Europeans to explore the rest of the world for resources and to control key trading routes.....................colonialism was a rivalry conquest between France, England, Spain and Portugal. These nations colonized the world to defend themselves from each other, such irony that the same countries are trying to hold a European Union together.

But i detest the fact that the key reason why Europeans colonized the world was because of racial hatred.................racial hatred was created in colonies for political reasons to justify slavery for large corporations that made plenty out of cheap labour. But it was not Europe's goal to destroy other races, that is my belief!
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@MommaC
Is it?
Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

The first of my surname who came here, did so because he got tired of being drafted into the never ending war they were having in Europe at the time :)
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@The-Rothschilds
While "Exploring the rest of the world for resources", what did they do to people they found in the parts of the world with resources?
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Sjekula

During those times, what did anyone do when they encountered aliens.

Im not defending the wrong of the past. Remember those times, there were no telephones, emails, CNN..................it took months, sometimes years to get to locations..............who knows the kind of crimes that were committed because of greed, anger, hunger etc
Report Abuse

Tusedi

Thanks to DA we have a mlungustan, that is cape town so dont worry de klerk your ancestors dream of a separate state with south africa already exists. Robin H is a native of that land where they think the anc is a black party.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@MommaC
When the war was never ending in Europe, they then decided to inflict pain on poor Africans they came across, but I cannot blame them on that, it could be that ubuntu spirit, the one that make africans think that people have nothing against you until you do them wrong.
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Tusedi
Thanks to DA we have a mlungustan, that is cape town so dont worry de klerk your ancestors dream of a separate state with south africa already exists. Robin H is a native of that land where they think the anc is a black party.
=================================================================================

And ANC supporters do not think the DA is a white party?
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ Sjekula

Two questions :

1. Do you also cond.emn the Z.ulu.s for dispos.sesing ( and slaugh.tering ) other trib.es during the Mf.ecane ?
2. Who did the west.ern cape area ( Kei River to the East, Orange River to the North) BELONG to when the Dut.ch sett.led there ?
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Sjekula
@MommaC
When the war was never ending in Europe, they then decided to inflict pain on poor Africans they came across, but I cannot blame them on that, it could be that ubuntu spirit, the one that make africans think that people have nothing against you until you do them wrong.
===============================================================================

Yes, some greedy criminal Europeans inflicted pain on many people across the world for commercial reasons, but it was mostly a few, which brainwashed so many others. If the media existed 500 years ago like it does today, perhaps those few criminal Europeans who turned exploration into a conquest for personal greedy w.ealth at the cost of destroying who ever stands in their way would not of gotten away with such a crime against humanity.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@The-Rothschilds
The point I'm making here is that africans cannot be judged on their past as most of you guys are doing, South Africans, particularly Africans, sacrifised a lot for a smooth transition into the non-racial state, but what is the use if people are still gonna judge them on other counties mistakes.
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Sjekula
@The-Rothschilds
The point I'm making here is that africans cannot be judged on their past as most of you guys are doing, South Africans, particularly Africans, sacrifised a lot for a smooth transition into the non-racial state, but what is the use if people are still gonna judge them on other counties mistakes.
==============================================================================

If you read what i said in my comments, you would realize that i defend the stance that Africa was better off had Europeans never invaded.................European invasion created the mess we in..................but i refuse to believe that it was the intention of every white person to do so....................if we could go back in time, im sure nearly every white person would of wanted things to be different. Me as a white person i take full responsibility for the pain you and your people are still going through today...............and i want to try and help and fix it, make things right, because this is my home.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@The-Rothschilds
By the past, I mean before colonialism because nobody knows how they were then, and they just wanted to impose upon them, and since then, it has been struggle for freedom for Africans, how can you think of inventing TVs when your movement is controlled, told when, what, and how to eat, sleep, walk, and even think.
Report Abuse

DeCock01

I have always said that this racist old man didnt and does not deserve the noble piece prize...look at his racist face...its disgusting...full of pretence....Who the hell do these wh!te supremacists think they are...??
Report Abuse

mambaaai

MommaC
Why do we keep tripping over stuff that is behind us?.... the SA with its current borders would never have been like this if it wasnt for the minority brothers the current borders include spaces that would most likely have been lots of small countries anyway.... ok so now we got racism and tribalism as a result of the borders...

Ok these borders have given people in different areas benifits of things not found where they are....

This idea of unifying smaller areas is common in the world... like the EU and the USSR etc... even China has many languages and old smaller states

had our minority brothers not done this and got us all on an equal footing , the bigger and stronger nations come and take over and c0ntrol the little ones... so we would have had zvlvs making us sl@ves or something lke that
Report Abuse

The-Rothschilds

Sjekula
@The-Rothschilds
By the past, I mean before colonialism because nobody knows how they were then, and they just wanted to impose upon them, and since then, it has been struggle for freedom for Africans, how can you think of inventing TVs when your movement is controlled, told when, what, and how to eat, sleep, walk, and even think.
==============================================================================

i feel your pain my man.................................which i why i want you to give me and millions of other white people a chance to prove that we can make things right for these crimes.
Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

Nobody was terribly civilised back then. Skin colour was irrelevant. It was the law of strength and if you were strong enough to take it then it was yours. Shaka and Mzilikhazi knew that.
Report Abuse

SteveBiko

RobinH
MommaC: Not discussion I even want to entertain. I live in Cape Town and no-one will ever force me to move. Not what the struggle was fought for, so no go. Not even hypothetically
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
you will leave on your own cause more b.lacks will come leave were you are and we all know how you and your people dont like sharing with us.
Report Abuse

DeCock01

How funny and typical SA wh!te supremacists thinking that they invented everything in the world and we owe them a big thank you for everything around us...lmao...rather move out of SA and go invent sh!t in Australia...the only thing you fools invented in SA was apartheid...we dont want it...take it with you stupid fvcks!!
Report Abuse

mambaaai

what happened here has happened throughout the world since, forever think of all the empires in the world....and make no error Genghis Khan, Alexander the great, the Romans, the ottomans etc etc etc etc etc etc ect all the people of the world just get over thems selves and their victim menatality and make what they have work
Report Abuse

Tasto

Have you seen Dzel & JajazQuuen of this site ? Plse your 2c comment plse !!
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ Sjekula '..Africans cannot be judged on their past.."

But w.hite SAfricans must ?

@ Tusedi. The ANC is not a blac.k party ?

Can a w.hite person ever become the leader of the ANC, or even any structure ? What must a w.hite member of the ANC do while they sing " dh.bula I'Bhunu" You know the answer.
Report Abuse

MommaC

mambaaai

Shaka had snuffed it by then and the isiZulu had gotten a bit bored with wading through bIood and guts so that is debatable. I think you are right about the lots of little countries though. As they say, tall fences make for good neighbours and the various tribal groups would possibly have made those fences as high as they could. Alternatively they could have morphed into one hydrogenous group with no clan or tribe structure at all.

What I was getting at is that the 'living apart' thing was less of a problem than the greed thing.
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01 well lets give credit where its due...and through time the advanced nations controlled the less advanced nations well that why they are our minority brothers they must have been more advanced

and even in modern times we have to admit...there are some things and people we can be proud of....we have to admit some stuff at some point
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@cornelius
1.All the tribes that Zul.us defeated are now Z.ulu(i.e. people who fought in wars were "Amabutho"), Shaka was not a loose canon out to purge all other tribes, but he conquered kingdo.ms, here he built one big tri.be.
2. I didn't do whi.te hist.ory, but all I know is that it didn't belong to the Du.tch S.et.tlers since they had their land somewhere in E.urope.
Report Abuse

mambaaai

MommaC I get your point although if we say its all choices... look at Irland for eg... they want independance.... question: So why didnt our clans or anyone else go for independance... why did the ANC stick to and accept SA with its wh!te borders....I think it comes back to geed any way...


Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

1. Those who resisted were slaughtered
2. Look it up. There was no Holland or Germany at that time.
Report Abuse

DeCock01

mambaaai

Admit what..?? What greatest invention is directly attributed to SA colonial invaders..?? Name just one bra!! I dont owe sh!t to 'racist bigoted supremacists' that think highly of themselves...I simply dont give a toss man!! When they came here....they found hunts with people getting by just fine...we were a civilisation...not animals...they must not think they changed us from animals to humans...if we think like you are thinking, whats the point of fighting racial segregation in this country...and who knows what level of development we would be if they didnt come invade our country...its a pity we are talking about what ifs...child like topics...

Report Abuse

mambaaai

Sjekula

@cornelius
1.All the tribes that Zul.us defeated are now Z.ulu(i.e. people who fought in wars were "Amabutho"), Shaka was not a loose canon out to purge all other tribes, but he conquered kingdo.ms, here he built one big tri.be.
---------------------------------

in which case its probably true to say that, all the smaller tribes can be greatful for still having an identity. In which case its what this old w1tee is getting at...
Report Abuse

MommaC

mambaaai

When it comes to politics, its ALWAYS greed
Report Abuse

DeCock01

cornelius
Can a w.hite person ever become the leader of the ANC, or even any structure ? What must a w.hite member of the ANC do while they sing " dh.bula I'Bhunu" You know the answer.
_______________________________

Oh yes they can became leaders!! And there are many wh!tes within the ANC that hold key leadership and ministerial positions within government!! If you are lacking in general knowledge, I suggest you read up some more...

As for the song....What do they do and what did the many non-racist wh!tes like Joe Slovo do when that song was sang..??

And what are you doing to your children to make sure that they dont end up being the next Leandres of this country..?? pfft
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01 they did the first heart transplant in the world, first space tourist, first paraplegic taking part in normal running competion, first human polar bear, the rooikat first optical aiming devices, guirilla war fair... biltong ... for cornelius boerewors
Report Abuse

Mamamedium

U kno what De K you just did not have a choice in the matter thats it. We woke up from a deep sleep and you were scared to death, first the Imbokodo ladies and the kids in 1976
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@MommaC
1. Were you there, why would they resist? Are you still trying to potray Shaka as a barbarian?
2. Who said anything about Holland/Germany, and if they were not in existence, why would you associate them with those countries.
Report Abuse

mambaaai

decock01 the now imfamfamous apartheid...and without it we would not have had what is a world icon as a leader our Madiba.... so in a way....we can say
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ DeCock. What were the borders of " your" country, what was its name, who governed it ?

Also, if you hat.e everything the Europea.n settle.rs brought and introduced, can I take it you are wearing a loi.n cloth and living in a mud hut as you type your vitri.ol ?
Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

1. I was brought up with Mzilikhazi's version of his brother's conquests
2. It wasn't me who brought up the Dutch it was you
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@cornelius
It is your kind that Afri.cans(Including myself) hat.e, narrow minded whi.te suprem.acists seeking to undermine every other ra.ce. You always cry foul on how people took things from you, get a life, in fact go to school, upgrade yourself and get yourself a job somewhere in europe as there is no room for your kind in South Africa.
Report Abuse

DeCock01

mambaaai

Bra...I think you have a different understanding to the word - invent...yes some you are dead right...like biltong...thats what they are good at...dead meat...im not sure of the Groeteskil heart transplant...not sure if it was the first one done...or the first one recorded and archived...but that was an achievement...
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@MommaC
1. White version of course.
2. I was responding to your brother cornelius, and your racis.t judgeme.nt took its toll on you such that you found the word Dutch offensive.
Report Abuse

DeCock01

mambaaai
decock01 the now imfamfamous apartheid...and without it we would not have had what is a world icon as a leader our Madiba.... so in a way....we can say
_______________________________________

Are you now claiming that the racist wh!tes invented Mandela..??? whats wrong with you chap...???
Report Abuse

mambaaai

Sjekula no need for that atttude on cornelius brother our eyes all have white in them... its like trying to rip your eyes out or your teeth out because they are a different colour.
We need to use what we have and pull together as Martin Luther King junior said "live together as brothers or perish together as fools" sure we all have different opinions, different parents and everyone makes mistakes bra... the NP made their our ANC are doing some....
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01 if aparrtheid wasnt there ... Madiba would have just been another lawyer, but out of that people from around the world wanna see the dude
Report Abuse

DeCock01

cornelius
@ DeCock. What were the borders of " your" country, what was its name, who governed it ?

Also, if you hat.e everything the Europea.n settle.rs brought and introduced, can I take it you are wearing a loi.n cloth and living in a mud hut as you type your vitri.ol ?
_____________________________________________

You are an old man to be talking about 'ifs and what ifs'....grow up will you...you have already indicated with an above comment that you have children...be a model to them with positive, mature and constructive thinking...

What adult has the nerve to come to a national and international blog and boast..."ha hah aha my forefathers in Europe invented the clothes you are wearing"..."hah ahha my forefathers in Europe invented brick houses…"....what have you invented here in SA old man....except for contributing to a pathetic and degrading belief system of apartheid...???? true what they say....the older you get....the more stupid you get...go take a nap old man!!
Report Abuse

MommaC

Sjekula

1. Mzilikhazi wasn't white
2. Its hard to be a Dutch settIer if there is no such place to come from to begin with
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@mambaaai
At the same time we must accept that some of us have different aspirations from ours, in fact opposite, hence africans had to thrive without the likes of Gatsha, Gqozo, Matanzima, Sebe, Ramodike, Mopeli, and Mangope.
Report Abuse

cornelius

Aaah DeCock, but they can never have real power, only the odd token here or there. Why are you so disturbed, your loin cloth too tight ?

@ Sjekula. If you read my posts properly and with an open mind you will see no racis.m, only defence against anti-wh.ite r.acism and hat.red. Read carefully, believe me.
Report Abuse

DJWinner

Why black_ and white people always fighting for no reason?
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@MommaC
1.That I know at least.
2. I took the word as it came from cornelius, and used it to respond, not unless it doesn't go down well when it comes from an african.
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DJWinner

Why black_ and white people always fighting for no reason?
-------------------------------------------------------------------


yebo I agree with you bro what's the point? It really doesent h3lp anybody......n0t one p3rson, n0t 0ne p3rsons h@ppiness, its like tripping over something behind y0u in l1fes journey...its plain dvmb


Report Abuse

DeCock01

cornelius
but they can never have real power
____________________________

And what is real power..?? Apartheid...?? lol...how old are you old man...??

Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01

real power is when you can make another do something they dont want to... even making somebody angry...because its their wish
Report Abuse

DeCock01

mambaaai
if aparrtheid wasnt there ... Madiba would have just been another lawyer, but out of that people from around the world wanna see the dude
______________________________

You are offside my bra...and Im sorry to say so but you are very short sighted...maybe you want us to thank the racist wh!tes for the many loved ones we lost through the oppression system while we thank them for keeping an innocent man in jail for 27 years...how you come to such a level of thinking is beyond me...but I think I see right through your pretence now...what a shame!!
Report Abuse

spatch

You gotta ask yourselves, would you have preferred a true African leader like Idi Amin, Charles Taylor, Mr Mengistu etc etc.....or Apartheid?

Trust me, when Rwanda and all those other free African stateas have a "Sharpville" you do not see only 67 de.ad......rather 690 000 de.ad.

Some appear to prefer to be cooked in a pot and eaten by Charles Taylor than apartheid. LOL


TAKE YOUR PICK.
Report Abuse

Sjekula

@cornelius
Weren't you attacking us with the Mfecane wars, hence I raised your wars back in Europe, meaning we all have our bad past, and if we're gonna focus mostly on where we come from, we're gonna hit a brick wall. I must however bring to your attention the fact that in the new South Africa, there were no intentions of looking at people as minorities and majorities but South Africans as a nation, opportunists found their way of creating such.
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01 Didnt say we must thank them.... look at it like this Neil Armstrong he never be know if it wasnt for the moon..... or for example Edmund Hillary who is he?........ quick do a google or jacques yves Coustau know him? or try Robert Oppenheimer what did he do? hopefully you see my point now



Report Abuse

DeCock01

mambaaai

you are confused and your examples have no bearing in these tragic situations...how you compare a man who went on a moon expedition to a man who was sentenced 27 years in prison for no crime at all is totally unconceivable...whats wrong with you???
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01

There were lots and lots and lots of people who DECIDED to do nothing....... so they didn't get locked up... lawayers know what they are doing....
Report Abuse

mambaaai

DeCock01 we have had these kinds of people through out history the Dali Lama is one at the moment....

know who Thich Quang Duc is?
Report Abuse

spatch

Imagine having Naiomi Campbell and Charles Taylor at your dinner table.

What do you serve foe starters?
Report Abuse

swona

I always said he is racist, and not only that model, all of them are!
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ De Cock, your statement is hardly worth dignifying, it will be clear to anyone who is not a blind idi.ot that I was not referring to apartheid, but to policy making in SA as it is now. My age has got nothing to do with anything my man, bu tif you must know, I was part of the generation of ' young w.hite libs" who supported the dismantling of apartheid in the 80's.

@ Sjekula, if you read higher up you will see that I responded to a blogger who out of the blue came and attacked the w'hites viciously (again, it happens the whole time)) for dispossessing blac.k people, being so evil, etc. I referred to the Mfecane wars to make the point that not only w.hite people did this sort of thing, and that it was in the old old days just the way things were - survival of the fittest, etc.

I am interested in the reason you find a reference to the Mfecane wars so distressing. Is it because it tends to undermine the very basis on which b.lack people can continue to call w.hite people evil, etc, and thereby justify continued state discrimniation against w.hites ? Why do you consider my reference to the Mgecane wars as an " attack" on you ?

Sjekula, I agree with you that in the new SA the intentions were for us all just to be one nation. This has gone down the to.ilet now, one often hears how w.hites must know their place. I think the cause of this is the following : With the demise of apartheid, there was great expectation among b.lack people that there lives will improve dramatically. However, this has happened only to a section - quite a large bl.ack middle class has been created, but many many people are still languishing in poverty. Instead of taking this out on the government who has allowed corruption and cronyism to chow tax money meant for creating jobs, eradicating poverty, service delivery, they take it out on w.hites. In this they are urged on by the like of Julius Malema and others. This has brought us to where we are now.
Report Abuse

Tasto

I always told you it is so difficult to find one single whitey who benefited from apartheid let alone supporting it !!
Report Abuse

spatch

Almost impossible to find anyone who opposed Charles Taylor (who was found guilty at the Hague court recently), Charles cooked and ate his oppositions.
Report Abuse

cornelius

@ Swona, please xplain what is racis.t about what he said ?
Report Abuse

cornelius

Well Tasto, maybe thats because those people are quite old and don't really get involved anymore. The last time anybody voted ' for ' apartheid, was the referndum of 1983 and even then, the people who voted "no" because they were against the changes ( i.e. " for" apartheid) were the minority, which is why the changes began. The " no" voters were the older genration - if you were say forty then your are now 70.


Report Abuse

Rragwe

faild
Report Abuse

bokaba.123

@Cornelius, it's good that you are engaging in debate. The current Dep. Min. of Justice, Comrade (note that I say comrade), Andries Nel was once deputy chief whip of ANC in parly. Comrade D. Hanekom is head of NDC as u might have seen in the news. The list is endless. So, ANC is not a black party.
Report Abuse

BraSipho

We should also be wondering what happened to all the money pumped into the former homelands?
Why are they still stuck in the stone ages with "traditional" leaders? Not elected but with lots of power?!
Report Abuse

Papage

Old age is a mental thin, people stop thinking properly
Report Abuse