DA LEADER Helen Zille - who is standing for another term as party leader - is calling for the formation of a new political party to challenge the ruling ANC.
I'm glad Zille has finally come to realise that the majority of South Afric*ns who happen to be bl*ck are not yet ready for a wh*te dominated party, whose supporters are mostly w*ites. You only need to go to N.E.W.S.2.4 to read the raci*l vitriol spewed by DA's wh*te supporters towards bl*cks. This vitriol has not done any good but alianate the bl*ck liberal middle class who would have otherwise been easily swayed to join the DA ranks. The DA's failure in Cape town to address welfare issues in areas like Khayelitsha coupled with the open t*ilets and f*reigners from EC fiasco, dents its reputation as a broad national opposition party. What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
langman
I have been blind all my life voting for this useless anc . This time around I will vote for Hellen zille Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
langman
Surely I have lost confidence in black leaders Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Afrojoy - If people had to vote for a party based on its supporters, then nobody would vote for the ANC. You complain about news[24], well you should read the sowetan comments :P
As for the black middleclass, they are the highest demographic of voters that have been switching over to the DA. 1.5 million voters in the last election.
Been calling for a new opposition party for years now... Still waiting... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
warry
Helen be patient you build a good party on good foundation, you might not rule now but the party will in future
@Afrojoy - What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way.
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True. The ANC is mess up the country and keep on blaming apartheid for everything. Yes, apartheid has left a huge economic gap between blacks and whites. Having said that, the ANC is busy leaving out the well working structures that were developed by the apartheid government. SABC, SAA, etc. Schools that were built are now being closed. We can't afford more mess. We need a strong opposition party. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
Zille the is noway I see this happening with due respect mam, the leaders in all political parties are power hungry like you, there is also a racial devide. If this party you are proposing as lead by you or any white person it is simply going to alienate black people. The only way that this can work is for black people to form the party in question and you and all the mickey mouse parties join in!!! It will not guarantee you a win but it will give you a chance in every polls. Ms Zille do ot allow your support in Cape Town cloud you the are a lot of black people who ha.te you and white people with a passion and even if they agree with your views just because they come from you their hatred blocks everything. I admire your ambition madam and in GP we have Jack the clown Bloom who normaly has interesting things to say!!! But pity like you he is white and the hatred blacks have for white people defeats his intensions...GOODLUCK Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
Afrojoy
What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way
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That is correct, what this country needs is the anything but the ANC type of party driven by blacks not associated with anyone COSATU, bloody SACP, DA, the circus COPE ect.... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tango
The will be a new party after Mangaung Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
Tango
The will be a new party after Mangaung
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Correct!!!!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
ha ha ha ha...Thanks for admiting that your party has failed..... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Flemza
Please madam Helen Zille is this another DA again you are planning to form, why are you advocating your personnal opion as a DA leader , please leave us alone to die with ANC with Zuma as ots leader and leader of the country , the whole country except a pocket few love Zuma hence Zuma and ANC are ruling the country and the country is progressing even though the whole world had rescession , but Zuma leadership saved us from the worst , so please madam don`t confuse us Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
Flemza
so please madam don`t confuse us
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How can you be confsed by a sewer pipe dream!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Cl!ck-
ANC will govern this country until Jesus Christ of Nazareth returns..
I think Madam is being economical wth da truth, she foresee loosing to Lindiwe DA leadership battle and she cannot subject herself under Lindiwe leadership as being blacklady, and for DA wl lose more whte votes once Lindiwe take over because it would seem black might be majority in future within DA upper structure, i might be wrong guys plz dont cruxify me. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
Well no sh!t Mrs Zille... How did you come to that conclusion? Sometimes, no scratch that, all the time I wonder if politicians think all the people are ignorant zealots with no upper brain functions. It makes the political system cheap and vapid. Report Abuse
That new party will end up like Cope. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The DA is winning. The ANC is losing. Your party lost its 2/3 majority, and will never get it back again. In all the contested by-elections (Except KZN), the DA won all the wards. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Cl!ck-
@ MorenaWaPolelo
When I watched the President's speech, I only saw Lindiwe amongst the audience.. But then again, reporters claim it was full..
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The DA is winning. The ANC is losing. Your party lost its 2/3 majority, and will never get it back again. In all the contested by-elections (Except KZN), the DA won all the wards
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Never say never!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
KingOfHearts
Zille is right, a new party is needed.in its formation i hope they do not make the same mistake cope made, which was to appeal on peoples rational over emotions. ANC wins votes because people are still voting with emotions over rational. to this day, some people when they vote for ANC, they vote for Mandela and not the ANC. Majority of South Africans are still bitter about the past and showing people that your party played a major role in the liberation struggle will sure win you votes. Parties like cope however came out criticizing communism and socialism.How many south africans actually know what that is?that was the downfall of Thabo Mbeki as well when he started pushing people into rationalising politics. thats is why Malema finds people to support him, because he appeal to their emotions over rational. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - What has the ANC done to win back its 2/3 majority? Delivered services? Improved education or healthcare in the country? What about transparency? Has it reduced corruption? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
THEmadame2B-BBEE
for some odd reason i find comments here depressing, maybe i should log out for good Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
There is that word gain, non-racialism which basically means the "new party" must pretend we never had apartheid or that we still suffer effects thereof.
How do you propose the formation of a new party then list "non-negotiables" before even dialogue has started. Zille wants other parties to merge with the DA on her terms which is disturbing and self-serving. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Shredder
@Cl!ck-
ANC will govern this country until Jesus Christ of Nazareth returns..
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Click, with due respect, Malema said we must not mix politics with religion. He said this thing of people saying the ANC will rule until Jesus Christ comes back is not on because Jesus Christ has not come back, but the ANC lost power in Western Cape and Midvaal. He says such people should not be trusted. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - What has the ANC done to win back its 2/3 majority? Delivered services? Improved education or healthcare in the country? What about transparency? Has it reduced corruption?
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Your correct Sin!! the things that you mentioned are not attended to the satifactory of every one, but the electorate in this country does not vote based on only that.. the voting in this country is based on colour boet and you must be naive to think that will change in 2014/15. The more the ANC sits on the right in parly there more they will have a crack at fixing all the things you mentioned!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
NwanaPhiri
so who takes over when zille steps aside ?
and i cant help but wonder, will the DA still win as much votes from whites if a black person is in charge?
i think she (zille) took all ths into consideration and decided a new political party was the way to go ! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mothata
I think Afrojoy is right, for DA to get more black voters who still think that the DA is a white party they must just put Lindiwe as their President. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
It saddens me to look at the comments to the top and see that there is people who is happy with the way the anc is running the country to the ground.
Please don't say we must not worry because December is on its way and change is going to happen, we have been hearing this for years.
It is just a proven fact that all liberation parties failed, it is time for the DA to take over and make the whole of SA to work as good as Cape Town. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Ratshufi
reason why the whole thing is called politics.
i stopped worrying my self with bullshit Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Hail
Way to go Zellie! we cannot keep going backwards to blame apartheid instead of moving forward and develop our own country to be able to compite globally. Where I work you have over 50 votes when I include my family and friends you going towards 100. Basotho ga ba kgone! they have proved that for the past 18yrs.I mean up to now we still do not know where we going as a country! All the 1994 promise they not even on quarter of their list in order to fulfill it. Ke kgale re dikoloha thaba so it is time to change direction. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Fhatu
Am not happy with the services that ANC is giving us , But cant vote for DA .
The party is already there.
It is called Friends of the Youth League!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
hell
I have not decided of which party to vote, for in the next coming election.
If there can be a party on their manifesto includes scraping of the unjust E-tolling, you have my Vote. I am tired of ANC. They are not listen to the people, but claims to represent us. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
Mothata
I think Afrojoy is right, for DA to get more black voters who still think that the DA is a white party they must just put Lindiwe as their President.
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Mangosuthu_, Lekota_ and Bantu_ are all black, but we don't vote for them. The blackout strategy will not work. People will continue to vote for ANC... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Ntsalake
ANC is not doing good, but to vote for DA eix... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Ratshufi
@hell
I have not decided of which party to vote, for in the next coming election.
If there can be a party on their manifesto includes scraping of the unjust E-tolling, you have my Vote. I am tired of ANC. They are not listen to the people, but claims to represent us.
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Dude i am with you on that one i dont really know if there is any party out there thats worth my vote Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Shredder
I am not happy with how the ANC is running the country. Eish!! I guess I have to take my chances with the madam (DA). Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
oldlady12
BTW, who else thinks this is a call for JM? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Ratshufi
@oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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i am impressed ....so now you realise you have been used just like we are used now by our own ANC Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that
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Good but you understand why black dont vote DA? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
NwanaPhiri
DJ - WINNER
no, they wont. white people wont vote for a black person. only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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smart move by zille, very strategic...
well, she remains a politician, at the end of the day its about power, white as she may be... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Silo4G
@oldlady12
Who else thinks this is a call for JM?
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Julias Malema is already leading Friends of the Youth League and they are trying to challenge the ruling ANC. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhiri
smart move by zille, very strategic
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strategic???? you must be confused at the meaning of the word!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
asaowe
Is she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
asaowe
Is she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl.
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I see this as here admiting that the party she leads does not stand a chance!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tango
DA LEADER Helen Zille - who is standing for another term as party leader
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When are they having their own Mangaung and who is challenging her? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
spirro
HELLEN SHUTUP YOU WILL DO THE SAME IF YOU WIN THE ELECTION,ALL POLITICIANS ARE CORRUPT YOU ARE THE SAME SO STOP PLAYING THE BLAME GAME HERE YOUR NOT A SAINT, AND IF IT HAPPEN YOYU WIN THE ELECTION YOU WILL BITCH LIKE NEVER BEFOR SO SHUTUP. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
asaowe
Is she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl.
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Yes... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Shredder
@oldlady12
BTW, who else thinks this is a call for JM?
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Good thought that can not be ignored. However, Julius is a racist(from his talks) I don't foresee him merging with whites :-D. Anyway, people do change, I think Julius would do anything to get rid of JZ, even merging with whites is possible. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
LeparaThePresident
Guys i read ,most of your comments. Though there is still parallel line between wh!tes and bL@cks i can see that there is a general consensus that the ruling party is directionless and ineptitude. I think madam Zille is just spoofing the politcal arena hoping that there are still NP members who wants to join them. The fact is, madam Zille knows that she cannot have AZAPO,PAC,SOPA, as her branded co-join party and she knows that the so called parties like FF,ACDP<UDM<IFP> GODI 's party, and most recntly formed party COPE to be on her lead. Everyone wants to eat, and they have hallucinations of becoming RSA President. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - "Tell that to your president. She is thinking about opening a new whites only party."
And where did she say this? And people wonder why you always get your facts wrong :P Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
cornelius
Such a move is long overdue. To the sceptics : Zille's utterances should prove to you that the DA is not intent on being a " whit.e" party that serves " wh.ite " interests. It is obvious that a party that is strong enough to defeat the ANC will have a majority of bl.ack members. She is not insisiting on being the leader of that party, please people, don't make up things. The leader can be a bl.ack person. It is Zille who is nurturing Lindiwe for bigger things - you people are obsessed with ra.ce.
@DZEL - I can hardly believe your comments. Clearly there has to be a commitment to certain core values, otherwise you are lumping together people who have no common goals, ideology. Jir sir, try to be objective, Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
We should not judge a group of people by the comments of a few big mouth cowards, sitting behind a desk cyberspace away from a klap. Unfortunately it is true that blacks see the DA as a white party and I believe they (DA) should have done more to develop and place black leaders... since there are strong ones out there. Maybe they should have focused more on strategically aligning their party, instead of trying to do the ruling party's work. As for Mazibuko... In my circle of friends and family she is pretty much liked, because she is articulate, intelligent and do not have to read speeches, but can actually give one. One should be realistic with racial divide, since I think there will always be in any social situation around the world in any country. What we should realize is that it is the minority who is usually far right and that we have a lot more in common in terms of expectations and dreams than we realize. We have good people among us across all races and I still believe that the latter constitutes the majority of us. People should realize that apartheid, as it was, will never be back. Unfortunately, due to ignorance and reckless politics a new apartheid is born, which is totally unnecessary and uncalled for. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
o, they won't. White people won't vote for a black person. Only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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Stop generalizing, do you know how many white people voted anc before?
All people should vote for any competent person, you are just to d.umb to notice this. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
NwanaPhiri
MorenaWapolelo
strategy???? you must be confused at the meaning of the word
a strategy is a plan of action designed to achieve a specific goal. strategy is all about gaining a position of advantage over adversaries or best exploiting emerging posibilities.
@MorenaWapolelo, try and link the above with my previous two comments. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!
So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote
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You can not tell people not to vote you must ecourage people to vote Sir!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
o, they won't. White people won't vote for a black person. Only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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Stop generalizing, do you know how many white people voted anc before?
All people should vote for any competent person, you are just to d.umb to notice this.
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They did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
@DZEL - I can hardly believe your comments. Clearly there has to be a commitment to certain core values, otherwise you are lumping together people who have no common goals, ideology. Jir sir, try to be objective
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Those core value would have to be proposed, debated and ratified by those who seek to participate in this new party, correct?
What gives Zille the right to list these values and state them as non-negotiables as if she has a god-given right to dictate terms to others?
!Sinudeity!
So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote.
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People will continue to vote for ANC and take to the streets for their demands. It's the only way to do things these days. ANC listens to demands, unlike your DA that goes to the court to prevent people from striking... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mgaraji
You must have been born after 94 to believe white people once voted for the ANC. During Mandela's presidency white were worst grumblers most emigrated during that time. Caucasians stated to over praise Mandela as a means to undermine Mbeki, as if they loved Mandela when he was president.
We are coerced to believe 94 generation is the most cleverest generation ever when they also suffer from the legacy of apartheid. Like it or not apartheid will be blamed till the end of time. Few successful blacks nursing their boardroom & neighbourhood relationship with the caucasians are irritated if apartheid is blamed. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - "Read between the lines."
You mean, make up your own bull$h17 as you go along. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
cornelius
@Dzel - the DA is the main opposition, and the strongest by far. She surely has the right to state what she considers to be non negotiables. I am pretty sure that you won't be able find fault with thoses, and will also recognise that they are precisely what is lacking in the present government. Cast aside your sceptimism Dzel and join the future ! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :P Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
mhlupheki
i have heared about the looming merger between cope and da, and after Mangaung they will be joined by malema's camp. i mean the economic freedom fighters. i dont see us loosing in Mangaung even with single vote. we will be celebrating as ussuall and that will be the birth of new baby that will fade like cope. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mgaraji
mkabayi
so the DA does admit now that they dont have any hope in hell of attracting the majority of African voters? SA cannot separate itself from the politics of ideology and identity.
name any self-respecting people in the whole world who've acquiessed to support, en masse, a formerly oppressive, foreign ruling class?
would the irish prefer to be ruled by a priviledged class of english descendants? would the french want to be ruled by naturalised frenchmen of german extraction? what would happen in israel if german descendents were to somehow establish a powerful political lobby there and campaign for elections? would the nation not be reminded of the horrors of the holocaust pepertrated by their forebearers?
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True dat. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Mgaraji - And those that do blame apartheid are all highschool dropouts? Point in question, JZ. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhiri
strategy is a plan of action designed to achieve a specific goal. strategy is all about gaining a position of advantage over adversaries or best exploiting emerging posibiliti
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You business school definition of the meaning of strategy, is not suitable for this argument first of all DA does not have advantage and socondly the are no posibilities emrging when the pupulation interms of race is against you!!!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
The irony is, 75% of the DA's support base is black. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
sh!tFaceSamsung
wil never happen in mi life to vote DA #white party# : over mi dead body Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
paracute
she is now feeling the heat of whites that are dominating her party that she filled their party with blacks and she knows well that they have nothing to do blacks. that's why she wants to build another party and that one definitely i will join, this lady has a style never mind her colour she has incredible and peaceful heart, don't be fooled by hatred and racism that you have. the thing is i hate all politicians so i will never affiliate to any political party Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Shredder
@DJ-Winner
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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New National Party and Democratic Party which gave birth to DA were there so she had an alternative. If she wanted to vote for a black party, PAC was there (first elections). Another thing, if she had no alternative she could have stayed at home like what other blacks are doing. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mbeki_2
You know - after 4 elections people have realised that their vote really is SECRET. ANC has used scare tactics so people think their vote paper can be known. I think they go to rallies and get food, and tees BUT i think in 2013 they are going to vote secretly (NOT ANC) or else they just will NOT vote. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
DJ-Winner
Jesus, with these violent strikes I will also go to court to prevent them. Strike and mass actions should have it's rightful place in society, not this violence that we see. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tango
!Sinudeity!
Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :
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ANC has never won WCape Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
asaowe
Sinu plz give us stastistic from DA plz Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
Shredder
@DJ-Winner
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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New National Party and Democratic Party which gave birth to DA were there so she had an alternative. If she wanted to vote for a black party, PAC was there (first elections). Another thing, if she had no alternative she could have stayed at home like what other blacks are doing.
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Nobody took seriously parties from aparteid regime... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
cornelius
@Dzel - the DA is the main opposition, and the strongest by far. She surely has the right to state what she considers to be non negotiables. I am pretty sure that you won't be able find fault with thoses, and will also recognise that they are precisely what is lacking in the present government. Cast aside your sceptimism Dzel and join the future !
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No, she can suggest principles along which the party should be formed, not dictate. If it is about who has what support then why merge at all, why pretend to form a new party when what you want is a super-sized DA where the status quo remains and Zille calls the shot.
She does not want a new party, she just wants more votes. Zille is a bigot and a hypocrite that is why I just can't bring myself to like this woman. On the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE yet on the other she window dresses her leadership so she can get black votes; does the irony escape you?
DJ-Winner - The DA is already winning. It took about 30 ANC wards in the past 2 years. It took a province from the ANC.
I remember when the ANC held CT, their finances were in tatters, and everywhere you go, there is some @sshole driving around with a picture of JZ on his car door. Havent seen a JZ car-door in years.
Haters will hate, but the DA will take more and more voters every election. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - "the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE"
DA doesnt oppose AA/BEE. It opposes narrow-based AA/BEE. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
By the way cornelous what is the future?
Zille wants a South Africa where labour rights are curtailed and one can be fired at will and without second thought. That incident where a worker was dismissed for bringing food to a KFC outlet would have ended up with the employee having no recourse and his constitutional rights violated. Is this the future you are talking about?
The DA needs a new leader with fresh ideas to move forward, Zille is not the right person to lead the DA, definitely not the right person to lead this new party she is talking about.
Jesus, with these violent strikes I will also go to court to prevent them. Strike and mass actions should have it's rightful place in society, not this violence that we see.
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Nobody wants to see violence. Even Msholozi said it in the UN, but there is no need to go to court to stop people from protesting peacefully.... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
asaowe - Which statistics do you want? Got plenty of comparative stats on DA and ANC. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
DA was the first white party that white people took seriously. All the other things nobody cares about...That is why I say white people did not have an alternative before DA...
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You are everything I said in my previous comment, what about the nnp and the DP? You must stop thumb sucking and look so stupid, there was many other parties as well, dude really, the sh1t you spew is really d.umb and there is d.umb people out there that might take your i.diotic comments as fact, training them also to be d.umbasses like you. STOP IT, make sure of your facts before you talk kak.
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The DA is already winning. It took about 30 ANC wards in the past 2 years. It took a province from the ANC.
I remember when the ANC held CT, their finances were in tatters, and everywhere you go, there is some @sshole driving around with a picture of JZ on his car door. Havent seen a JZ car-door in years.
Haters will hate, but the DA will take more and more voters every election.
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Zille wants to open a new party because DA can't win. Zille is admitting... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - "the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE"
DA doesnt oppose AA/BEE. It opposes narrow-based AA/BEE.
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Sin, we've been through this before I don't need to prove to you for the umpteenth time why race based AA and BEE is necessary and what the DA proposes is not genuine nor is it practical.
Dzel - Dude, you are merely speaking from your hate for the DA. Your comments are not even factionally correct. Dont be a DJ-Winner here dude. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Yeah, we have discussed this PLENTY of times before. But every single time you revert back to the lie that the DA opposes BEE/AA.
@DJ-Winner - Nobody took seriously parties from aparteid regime...
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Even whites? Bearing Oldlady4 that she is white. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
Dzel
She opposes bee, because in essence it is and proved to be unsuccessful. Secondly AA: This is damaging to the deeper sense of humanity and self actualization. Take JP in our national cricket team, he stepped out once because he said he wanted to play for the national team because he is the best, not because of his skin colour. And what did he and many other's prove, both on sport and other levels? IT'S TRUE. He and many others are there because they're 'flippen good!' Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, you are merely speaking from your hate for the DA
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On the contrary, I think the DA is the only alternative to the ANC and would gladly vote for any party that can turn the tide of corruption, maladministration and other ills plaguing the ANC. The party however needs to also represent our collective interests and pursue these with direction and determination, it is a lack of appetite for the latter that turns me off.
The DA is pro-business much like Republicans are in the states, a party that is more concerned about business interests than it is about inequality, civil liberties and improving the lives of the people they represent is not the party for me.
Zille is an impediment to progress, one gets the feeling so ling as she is party president the DA will remain pro-business and will continue thinking window-dressing is the right way to win black votes; it isn't. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mndende
Zille you have my vote I am a registered Soweto voter with my whole family and relatives and my whole street except for two families who are on the ANC gravy train...the rest of us are DA!!!!! Asisayifuni i ANC but liberation movements don't live past 40 years, ours won't live past 30 years!!!! The ANC has expired probably Jesus is at the door!! Never say never! No one ever thought the ANC would rule don't write the DA off thina siyayivotela goeddddd.... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mndende
Lindiwe is huge and big and not a pretty face for sure but none of the ANC nincompoops come close to her smartness and eloquence and common sense!!!!That is a fact. The ANC thrives on rhetoric and populism and Lindiwe on facts. Lets give credit where its due.. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-business. How else do you want to create employment? The ANC is also pro-business.
"The DA is pro-business much like Republicans are in the states"
The democrats are also pro-business dude :P You do know that the democrats bailed out the automotive industry in the US, right?
No party in South Africa is like the republicans, you do realise this right? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
asaowe
I still repeat Ziller sees DA leadership swaying to Lindiwe's way and DA loosing white votes, all about power ppl. DA will be all black in 2020 leadership level. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Chichi7
The majority of blacks would rather have incompetent govt than allow whites to rule them. Truth is much as they hate corruption and all that is happening in the Govt right now, they hate the history attached to whites more. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Cheney who was on the board of Haliburton? He was a republican. What about the ANC, having board members on plenty of the mine companies. What about Hitachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the republican party right. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Yeah, we have discussed this PLENTY of times before. But every single time you revert back to the lie that the DA opposes BEE/AA.
Whats up with that son?
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Don't call me son, I am not your friend.
I have asked you many times to explain to me how this will work in practice and you couldn't.
If you can't break this need based AA and BEE down and explain how it will work the shut the hell up. If you think you can put together a coherent argument this time around then the floor is yours. Convince me that the model as proposed by Zille will work particularly with apartheid and socio-economic circumstances we find ourselves in by race; I suggest you start by answering the question are we economically equal along racial lines? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Cheney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on plenty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican party right. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
She is aware if what we have been preaching to her little puppies blogging here that ANC currently might be messed up but DEvovledApartheid is no an laternative of the Black people it was and will never be!!
@RobinH @Sinudity did u hear & yr crew? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mndende
Those 4 values are indeed essential to steer growth in SA. Those are facts! Lol now folks your ANC has white members and ministers if you claim that whi.tes never vote ANC what do you really mean? Are you that racist? What are those whi.te faces doing in parly I mean wh.ite ANC faces, the Ben Turoks, Hanekom,George Bizos...shame I pity any wh.te man who votes ANC...YOU are nothing but a used condom!!! The ANC is more racist than the DA! That is a fact! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
asaowe
I will reiterate: Most white folks I know like Lindiwe. They do not care about colour, but efficiency. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
"The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pr0-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pr0-busin3ss.
"The DA is pr0-busin3ss much l1ke R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pr0-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Oops, sorry, Sowetan is broken, not me :P Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Every single time I explain to you how it will work in practise. Dont talk k@k buddy.
You want evidence that the DA's model is working?
Lets look at national unemployment stats, shall we?
National unemployment: 25%
WCape unemployment: 18% (lowest in the country)
During the recession, South Africa bled 500,000 jobs. The WCape created 10,000 jobs.
Short term - cut of the weed... It grows again. Medium to long term - destroy the roots of the weed... problem solved. Education is the medium to long term answer... and how does our education system stand currently? IT'S A MESS!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
Tasto
She is aware if what we have been preaching to her little puppies blogging here that ANC currently might be messed up but DEvovledApartheid is no an laternative of the Black people it was and will never be!!
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Why would she want to bring back apartheid if she was one of the biggest anti-apartheid activities, I wish people would start to try and think before they spew sh1t here. just try, it will make your life much easier. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
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Maybe I should explain this s.l.o.w.l.y. DA is a party that will see businesses get tax breaks, incentives and even be subsidised by tax funds i.e. the youth wage subsidy while the poor the poorer.
I don't subscribe to a mentality that says 2 jobs for the price of 1 with each getting half-a-salary is better than 1 job at full salary. Yes you may be creating 2 jobs but the two workers will be equally poor and will earn enough just to keep them going. That is apartheid mentality where workers had no rights, no recourse and were cheap resources to raise madam's kids.
DA's policy will take us back a few years as a nation, yes more may be employed but earning a slave wage and work under hellish conditions, how do I support that? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
The DA will bring back apartheid.
The DA is against BEE/AA
Ignorant people say the darndest things :P Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Every single time I explain to you how it will work in practise. Dont talk k@k buddy.
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Maybe in your head you make sense but in reality you don't. I've asked you to give it a shot if you think you can explain it so it makes sense and instead of doing that you tell me I am talking crap.
Don't waste my time if you can't respond to a simple request, I am in no mood to be disrespected by you. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - EVERYONE supports the youth wage subsidy. The ANC, the DA, the BMF, SACP, BLA, SASCO, COSAS...
Except, COSATU and Dzel :P
"DA's policy will take us back a few years as a nation, yes more may be employed but earning a slave wage and work under hellish conditions, how do I support that?"
Meanwhile, under the ANC's labour laws, 40 people died at a mine. The ANC has already taken us backwards son. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
During the recession, South Africa bled 500,000 jobs. The WCape created 10,000 jobs.
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Which companies, which industries, what kind of jobs and what is the average wage?
Dzel - Not going to waste my time in explaining BEE/AA to you again for the 100th time. Nor am I going to bother pasting the policy PDF's and links again for you, for the 100th time.
As for your arguments today, merely going to throw you into the same bucket as DJ-Winner. IE, $h17 talkers. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Fred55
I would love a party to be formed with the following black leaders:
Dr Mamphela Ramphele
Thuli Madonsela
Vusi Pikole
Trevor Manuel Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
@!Sinudeity! - Hey wena your madam is a major share holder at PicknPay with their slavery practices and casualisation of work.Can u imagine DevolvedApartheid even municipalities will be casualised !!
@Solutions – solution to what ? Another cracker Arrogant stupid white if u had solution from 1948 up to now this country wouldn’t have been in this mess it is.You grandfathers’s plan of Social-engineering has caught up with you and u whinging ppl why are u still here othas left and came back in droves we are not impress to say the least!!
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I am sorry, I was not here in 1948 you d.umb turd, I am here now and trying to build a better economy for my country, but with d.umbf*^ks like yourself it is difficult. I am not whining, I am stating the obvious facts that you are to s.tupid to see. Go look in the mirror and hate yourself more Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Fred55
The country is in a crisis and all the parties should ask Dr Mamphela Ramphele, Thuli Madonsela
Vusi Pikole,Trevor Manuel to govern on behalf of everyone in this country until we get out ourselves out of the crisis. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mndende
Siyaya ne DA phambili. The DA is showing growth what do you guys think? Do you think it is whyte folks? Pro business is good...pro equality is also good...but how do you make people equal unless you give out the best education system. Zimbabweans are more unequal now than ever before because equality cannot be tackled by man because we can all get R2 but one will decide to save it the other devour it the saver creates wealth the other not! If we continue to have more children than we can afford why should someone who has one child and is well educated be forced to be equal with someone who isnot? Being rich is no sin that is why my friend Mdletshe who is illiterate but managed to buy 41 taxis and started out as a taxi driver....anyone can be rich if they have the will.......to be....just create equal opportunities to resources and lets all fight and strive for equality. My brother is not equal to me. I have 4 kids he has one and he is enjoying life and wants no more kids....just an example!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Fred55
Tasto, you are clearly a racist that can offer no reasonable solutions.
Also, please provide proof that Helen Zille is a major shareholder in Pick n Pay. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
bytheway1
Dzel
Short term - cut of the weed... It grows again. Medium to long term - destroy the roots of the weed... problem solved. Education is the medium to long term answer... and how does our education system stand currently? IT'S A MESS!!!
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Education? You guys must think you can flash this education card and all arguments disappear.
Obviously education is a solution in the long run but please explain to me how is education an alternative to AA and BEE in the short to medium plan. How does it guarantee representative at all levels and uplift living conditions of black people in general in the short term?
Give me practical example, not theory please. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mndende
Fred you are right! I would also add Joel Netshitenze to those names there.... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
Fred55
I would love a party to be formed with the following black leaders:
Dr Mamphela Ramphele
Thuli Madonsela
Vusi Pikole
Trevor Manuel
-----------------------------------------
I like your lineup, especially the top 2. Report Abuse
So the crackers are giving up on governing, thats why they are retreating to the private sector and treating blacks like sh1t neh? Thats my opinion by the way. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
As I said DA was the first white party that white people took seriously. All the other things nobody cares about...That is why I say white people did not have an alternative before DA... Those small parties you are talking about, nobody gave a fcuk about...
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Dude, you are a d.umb f*^k, a real turd who can't even think for himself, go and look at the facts you idiot, The NP was the 2nd biggest contender in 1994, then in 1999 it was the DP, then in 2000 the DP changed its name to the DA. F*^k if you do not even know this you should really not even speak politics you ugly piece of rotten placenta.
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Look between you legs, you will see a dumbie surounded by mayonaisse. L!ck some of that sh!t, you a$$hole...
I told you fool that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime...Are you drunk or what? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Lehido
Im not happy with the ANC but What Hellen is saying will happen in her wrinkled dreams Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - "your madam is a major share holder at PicknPay with their slavery practices and casualisation of work"
LOL, no she's not.
The ANC on the meanwhile, shareholders in mine where people were shot, after they said they were getting paid minimal wage for dangerous work. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The ANC is a party from the apartheid regime. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Fred55
Mndende
Fred you are right! I would also add Joel Netshitenze to those names there....
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Well why don't we use this blogging platform to put a "dream" team together to govern this country?
I am happy with black leadership but the team must be the best, most honest and least corrupt people leaders in this country. They must have clean hands.
I would add Professor Jonathan Jansen to the list. He can head up the Education ministry and I would keep Dr Aaron Matsoaledi as minister of health. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Not going to waste my time in explaining BEE/AA to you again for the 100th time. Nor am I going to bother pasting the policy PDF's and links again for you, for the 100th time.
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Thought as much, keep pretending you have made a point if it makes you feel good about yourself or you could do it again so that we don't waste time debating whether or not one was made in the past.
You can't even explain how one would define "need" on which the proposal is going to be based, all you can do is refer me to DA policy but I keep on telling you it does not explain anything. It is a document meant to make the DA look like they care when they don't, it is self-serving and thin on detail but if you think this amounts to an argument on your part then good for you. Unfortunately even if you did that you still would not have answered basic questions. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, you keep saying that the DA is against BEE/AA, even though, they are in favour of BEE/AA.
We are not even talking about the youth wage subsidy, which seems is what you are building your entire wobbly deck of cards on.
So, back to you, give me evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The ANC is a party from the apartheid regime.
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LOL.... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhiri
!Sinudeity!
Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :P
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Now that is strategy!!!!
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
...
Look between you legs, you will see a dumbie surounded by mayonaisse. L!ck some of that sh!t, you a$$hole...
I told you fool that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime...Are you drunk or what?
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Sorry I do not have m.offie t.endencies, go and l.ick yours and see if it tastes the same as your mothers, placenta boy. Go and read my comment again slowly, I gave you the alternatives who was voted for.
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Your mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Tasto - LOL, Im also a shareholder in PnP. Anyone can buy shares. That doesnt make hellen a 'major shareholder'. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
FlyMachene747
Siya5297
Dear Sis Dolly
I'm a 70 year old married man with 20 children and 6 wives...recently I had a child with my bestfriend's daughter...should I marry her?... from anonymous... eNkandla
_________________________________________________________________________________
Sis Dolly replies....:vo3tsek Zuma! I know its u.
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Haahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!! kwikwikwikwikwikwi tltltltltltltl....boom fatshe!!!! Eish! pleasee dont k1ll me man!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DrunkenMaster
I do not have a problem with ANC led government but i Have a problem with their fraud and corruption. Most of their so called leaders are not educated at all. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MommaC
SA's complete political landscape needs a makeover. Everything from how we elect leaders to how the tiers of government interact. We have a shithouse load of politicians and nothing to show for it. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Winilen
Well Madam Zille for your information SA is still much divided between blacks & white... black people will never see eye to eye with white & ANC knows that very well & we should all axcept it...
For a party like that to be formed it will need a black person as leader(not controlled by white like what the companies do bcos of BEE s&%$t) bcos majority of blacks still believe in ANC. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
@!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again.
Hope Mangaung would come up with another resolution instead of reducing Bantusatans called "provinces" total dump this beurocracy !!
Secondly u claim that u r also a PnP share holder, u like Juju neh ? Will defend HZille even withg lies or U will kill for Zille ? Report Abuse
So, back to you, give me evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA.
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You have not answered my question and you think you can turn around and put me on the spotlight, not a clever debating strategy Sin.
Anyway I'll oblige; do you understand what the objectives of AA and BEE are and why it is necessary to implement corrective measures long racial lines GIVEN THAT apartheid was a system meant to oppress and enslave along racial lines.
Do you understand that there is skewed distribution of labour by race from the lowest levels to executive and board levels. Do you understand there is still disparity by race in terms of income, living conditions, business opportunities etc by race. Do you understand there is direct correlation between race and the average property value by suburb.
If all indicators are that we are not equal and whites are at the top of the pile in every measure that counts then surely logic dictates that solutions must be formulated along racial lines. How does the principle of non-racialism uplift black people as a whole? How does it ensure we have better access to employment opportunities at a wage that is justifiable given the amount of effort required. What has the DA done to show their are genuine in the advancement of black people and I am not talking about poster-girl Mazibuko who advancement - if you call it that - was only done so they could fool blacks into voting DA?
How does a party that purports to advance my interests tell me, inspite of history and inspite of current trends regarding access to and distribution of wealth by race that sorry but the solution cannot be along racial lines. How do you explain that logic and is that a party that is genuinely committed to my advancement?
The problem with you Sin is you just say stuff without much thought process going on that is why you have somehow convinced yourself you make sense, think Sin please. Maybe if you thought more I would not have to explain the obvious man, use your brain for a change and stop being driven by your ego. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
Dzel
So we agree on medium to long term. I do not know if you read one of my previous posts on bee / AA - that is my personal view. In practice AA jobs went to unqualified people, which created more problems than any solutions - it's wishful thinking. AA would not have been a problem if it was correctly implemented. Mayby AA worked for lower end jobs. As for BEE... phew? What can be said apart from bad implementation supporting tenderpreneurs benefiting a few. Instead of politicians ranting and raving about this and that, meaningful debates should concur on the issues that you and I are discussing, because sometimes we only ill-defy ourselves and maybe our theories overlap without us realizing it... I hope I have put this correctly. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - "Secondly u claim that u r also a PnP share holder"
Yeah, got about R5,000 worth of shares in PnP. Bought it via PSGonline.co.za - Why dont you have any shares? Always complaining that 'minority control the economy', but refuse to buy shares himself :P
I will never k1ll for a politician. Just setting the record straight here. You just had to say 'major shareholder'. Which is not the truth unfortunately for you. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
Your mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Your comment is fart....
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Your mother must have at least wife kids and fathered from different men and you want to call mine name. lololololol
google election results 1994 and you will get 1997 as well.
Go and search for them yourself, see if you can do it. See that you are wrong again. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
BlackSeed
You sound frustrated and lost now Helen. Are you getting pressured by the investors? Remember that investors want a political party that is in government for them to fulfill their corrupt desires. Are they threatening to pull out now since DA is going nowhere but fixed in the Cape for the few?
Do that in the Cape and you’ll have support of the whole country. You don’t need to go into government in order for you to address issues in Cape Town.
Your marginal thinking can only afford you marginal support; that’s how it is.
Julius Malema will overtake you and become your boss one day; I wish to see your face then.
You need to start opposing the ANC through service delivery, not ganging up with other political parties to try and overthrow them; how do you think that will go down with some poor people in this country.
White ancestors caused this and unfortunately their siblings will suffer for eternity; just like some blacks do.
5 kids djwinner, not wife kids, that would not make her a W Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Mzabalazo
Sep 28, 2012
Shredder
@Afrojoy - What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way.
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True. The ANC is mess up the country and keep on blaming apartheid for everything. Yes, apartheid has left a huge economic gap between blacks and whites. Having said that, the ANC is busy leaving out the well working structures that were developed by the apartheid government. SABC, SAA, etc. Schools that were built are now being closed. We can't afford more mess. We need a strong opposition party.
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You deserve a kiss, your comment is spot on Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, I actually dont have to justify anything. YOU opened up with the statement that the DA is against BEE/AA. The onus is on you to back up your comment with some proof.
Do you understand how debating works?
"Do you understand that there is skewed distribution of labour by race from the lowest levels to executive and board levels. Do you understand there is still disparity by race in terms of income, living conditions, business opportunities etc by race. Do you understand there is direct correlation between race and the average property value by suburb. "
And is this across South Africa (ANC provinces) or just in the WCape?
Come on dude, your arguments fail. You are like DJ, merely say the first thing that pops into your head, without any backing for it. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MGEEZ
Zille for President!!!! She is the solution to the manifold problems that the Corruption party (ANC) has put our people through!!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Meanwhile, the SAIRR, did a skills audit, and found that the argument that people are placed in businesses by race to be invalid, and that placement indeed happens on education.
And yet here you are, shooting down the importance of education. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
Your mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Your comment is fart....
-----------------------------
Your mother must have at least wife kids and fathered from different men and you want to call mine name. lololololol
google election results 1994 and you will get 1997 as well.
Go and search for them yourself, see if you can do it. See that you are wrong again.
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Yours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice... Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
bytheway1
So we agree on medium to long term. I do not know if you read one of my previous posts on bee / AA - that is my personal view. In practice AA jobs went to unqualified people, which created more problems than any solutions
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You are looking at AA from an incorrect position. Let's take spot for example.
What quotas did was force coaches to field players of colour, obviously since winning is the ultimate prize these players were given the necessary support, given the opportunity and training to make them successful so they got better and better. In Rugby we had Chester Williams in '95 but later we had the likes of Breyton Paulse, Ashwin Willemse (sp?) etc and now the likes of Mvovo, Ndingane twins, Elton Janties, etc. In cricket we now have a Philander who is up there with the best. Amla is probably the best batsman we have produced post 1994 if not ever.
The point is because we gave these guys opportunities and made sure they have all they need to succeed and now they are important members of both rugby and cricket teams. We have a bigger pool of players to choose from and as a result our squads are better. The alternative would have been keeping both sports as white preserves and we would not have had these wonderful players.
Similarly with AA what you need is someone with the rights qualifications, right attitude and right drive. With the necessary support and training these individuals will become better and will contribute meaningfully in the success of the company. You speak of these individuals as unqualified but I have a long list of impediments AA candidates face including regressive attitudes like yours that assumes because one is black then they are less qualified and less capable; what do you base this statement on exactly? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
BlackSeed
You sound frustrated and lost now Helen. Are you getting pressured by the investors? Remember that investors want a political party that is in government for them to fulfill their corrupt desires. Are they threatening to pull out now since DA is going nowhere but fixed in the Cape for the few?
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Which investors are you talking about, also why did the DA take another 2 wards in black areas just last week, kaya and another one if they only cater for a few?
Do that in the Cape and you’ll have support of the whole country. You don’t need to go into government in order for you to address issues in Cape Town.
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What issues, Cape Town is the bes run city in Africa.
Your marginal thinking can only afford you marginal support; that’s how it is.
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The problem is marginal thinkers is in the majority at the moment and is voting for the corrupt, with every election and every bi election the DA is winning support because the marginal thinkers eyes are opening and starting to think outside the box and not marginally anymore.
Julius Malema will overtake you and become your boss one day; I wish to see your face then.
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HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAAHHA, he has already overtaken her with about 200kg's
You need to start opposing the ANC through service delivery, not ganging up with other political parties to try and overthrow them; how do you think that will go down with some poor people in this country.
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Go and see how many RDP houses and basic services the DA provided against the anc in the same time frame, if DA did not do this why were they not voted out with the last election but received more votes. (logic)
White ancestors caused this and unfortunately their siblings will suffer for eternity; just like some blacks do.
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I am not suffering, I am working my ass off, I work from 07h00 until 21h00 at night, but it is worth it. No need to suffer for anyone. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
Yours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
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I see the truth hurts, how many bro's and ho's do you have from different fathers, do you even know yours.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
I ask you please to check it out, you will see you were wrong again,
OOOOOPPPPPPSSS djloser is wrong again./ Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Meanwhile, the SAIRR, did a skills audit, and found that the argument that people are placed in businesses by race to be invalid, and that placement indeed happens on education.
And yet here you are, shooting down the importance of education.
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Comprehension skills are important Sin. I never said education is not important, I said let us not front it as an alternative to AA in the shot-term; I hope this is not too complicated a statement for you to process.
You can either start answering questions so we can have a constructive debate or you can keep on ducking and diving and making stupid comments that do not take us forward. The choice is yours but I am not going to let your ego get in the way of the debate around what needs to be done to uplift black people in general and why some parties cannot front themselves as agents of that change.
If you don't have anything of substance to add I beg you to stop with your pointless one-liners, it is obvious there is noting constructive that one should expect from you Sin; it is all about you and you having the last word when you've said absolutely nothing worth taking note of. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
Tasto
South African Black children in WC are called refugees in their own country by a European!!Sowetan Ediotor\webateam want us to say One S.ettler One Bouguet-o-Flower instead of One S.ettler One B….
HZille go to hell !!
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Don't change her words, she said educational refugees and she did not use any word of colour, there is a difference.
Why did you not make a big stink when one of your anc cadres called black people migrants? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - The folks in the ECape who moved here because of deteriorating conditions in the ECape are refugees.
You should be raging at the ECape government, not at the WCape about this issue.
The ECape government now has to fire 11,000 teachers, because it cant afford them. Were expecting a bigger influx of refugees from the ECape in preperation for the next schoolyear. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
cornelius
@DZEL the future is a stable, well run country, creating wealth through a market system that is essentially free, but with sufficient regularisation and social policies to prevent rampant capitalism and to ensure a sufficient safety net even for the poor, unemployed and uneducated. The key to a winning nation is education - for this a lot of money is needed to properly equip and staff especially the schools in the previously disadvantaged areas - Sadtu will have to be reigned in so that teachers can stop thinking of themselves as workers, but as committed professionals in a noble profession. putting the education of our children above everything else. We HAVE to get rid of the scum teachers who are failing our children with their strikes at important times, drunkennes, sexual conduct, etc, this is crucial. The rich schools must take a back seat while the schools in the townships are brought to world class standard. Affrimative action policies must be maintained, but implemented effectively and fairly, by a government that will not allow itself to fall into the trap of cronyism, and not create an absolute bar to employment of w.hites, discouraging youth in the minority groups, such as Woolworths did recently - that is unconstitutional and a violation of the EE Act by the way. Our constitution provides a briliant frasmework for the society we should be - it must be our bible.
In ten years, we can achieve the dream of nonracialism, where the colour of a persons skin will not count ( Martin Luther King, Bob Marley, Nelson Mandela ) and then we can become one of the strongest nations in the world, taking Africa with us.
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
Yours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
--------------------------------
I see the truth hurts, how many bro's and ho's do you have from different fathers, do you even know yours.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
I ask you please to check it out, you will see you were wrong again,
OOOOOPPPPPPSSS djloser is wrong again./
.................................................................................................
You are a product of prostitution and you know it.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
@Mzabalazo - You deserve a kiss, your comment is spot on
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Mcwaah! :-D Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
DJ-Winner
You are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
Dzel
On sport level, I agree with your comment... but they are there purely because they deserve it, not because of quotas. On AA: I surely do not assume that blacks are less qualified.... I should be a fair game - employ the best candidate, irrespective of skin colour. The thing is, especially looking at local government, is your scenario reflective, or is it nepotism? Look, I do not have formal figures based on studies, but there were some situations in my area where very qualified whites lost against much lesser qualified blacks. And, this educational mess is surely not doing much for equalizing the employment situation. I take your comment to heart, but we also need to look at the situation holistically. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - You are the one evading the questions dude. You said that the DA is against BEE/AA.
I'll ask you again (Please answer the damned question, stop evading it)...
What proof do you have?
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You mean after that lengthy explanation you still don't get it, I am afraid I don't have a Panado for what it is you are suffering from man. You are on your own on this one, those brain cells must have stopped working a long time ago.
Enough of this, stop wasting my time Sin. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
You are a product of prostitution and you know it.
-----
and you of rape.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
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you are a f__king idiot, I just gave you the proof. Look at the numbers on that page, some whites voted anc, the majority did not, unless there were 10 million whites in SA which there was not.
Lets stop, go and search for your father, maybe he can give you some brains, you need it. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
bytheway1
Dzel
On sport level, I agree with your comment... but they are there purely because they deserve it, not because of quotas. On AA: I surely do not assume that blacks are less qualified.... I should be a fair game - employ the best candidate, irrespective of skin colour.
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How old are you?
Do you even understand why AA is necessary? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Printa
Very intelligent move Mam 'uzille. Its an idea really that will liberate all SAfricans Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - ROFLOL, you havent explained ANYTHING son. You tried to tell me the definition of BEE/AA, and why it is needed. You havent provided ANY evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA. You used the youth wage subsidy to liken them to the republicans.
That is all, you havent provided ANY PROOF.
We can all assume from your reluctance to provide facts here, that the DA is indeed in favour of BEE/AA.
Thanks son. Your inability to debate is staggering./ Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - You are the one evading the questions dude. You said that the DA is against BEE/AA.
I'll ask you again (Please answer the damned question, stop evading it)...
What proof do you have?
You are wasting your time with this one dude. i have tried to get answers from DZEL before to no avail. he uses long sentences but has yet to fully answer ANY question posed and the throws in the usual "Enough of this, stop wasting my time" as he cannot back up any of his statements. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
DJ-Winner
You are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc.
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He reminds me of Cartman from South park. When he starts to lose an argument, the only thing you get in response is "Scr3w you guys, Im going home" Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
Dzel
Not from the NP!!
The Democratic Alliance (DA) is a South African political party, the governing party in the Western Cape province, and the official opposition to the ruling African National Congress (ANC). The party traces its roots to the anti-apartheid movement of the 1970s and 1980s, during which time it was known variously as the Progressive Party, the Progressive Reform Party, and the Progressive Federal Party.
"During the 1990s the party was known as the Democratic Party, but was renamed to the Democratic Alliance, during a short-lived alliance with the New National Party (NNP) in 2000 - the NNP subsequently left to join the ANC."
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winner
You are a product of prostitution and you know it.
-----
and you of rape.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
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you are a f__king idiot, I just gave you the proof. Look at the numbers on that page, some whites voted anc, the majority did not, unless there were 10 million whites in SA which there was not.
Lets stop, go and search for your father, maybe he can give you some brains, you need it.
...............................................
I told you where idiot is. Did you l!ck that sh!t yet or you are saving it for dinner?
Your stupid stats have failed to support your comment. How about shoving that stats in your stinking a$$hole?
I had no idea this lady was so popular. Maybe Julius and Helen? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MAPENDANA
Morning Guys :
well i think rlly Hellen is having a point ,but for her and his family and frends to do it for deir needs coz dey all hungry lions, not dat dey think abt how we S>A feels, and dey fool us why dey jst don clean da mess instead of continuing to have more partys wat dat mean ... well i think hellen fools us how many parties we have sam are olready dead by now but when kufiki xesha loku khankasa all parties jst wake up from deir graves ,,,,
4 me ill rada vote for NFP. why not we change guys and let us have a black women leader what you think guys jst asking ? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
According to history, it seems that the NP is more comfortable with the ANC, than it was with the DA.
The Democratic Alliance (DA) is a South African political party, the governing party in the Western Cape province, and the official opposition to the ruling African National Congress (ANC). The party traces its roots to the anti-apartheid movement of the 1970s and 1980s, during which time it was known variously as the Progressive Party, the Progressive Reform Party, and the Progressive Federal Party.
Does this help in any way?
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You know the problem is I am debating against ignorance.
Guys look up how the then DP merged with the NP, research how and why floor-crossing legislation was introduced, look at how the NP leadership left the alliance after they were made the junior partner in the alliance.
If you knew what you were talking about we would not need to debate obvious points then you top it all off by providing links. Report Abuse
DJ-Winner
I told you where idiot is. Did you l!ck that sh!t yet or you are saving it for dinner?
Your stupid stats have failed to support your comment. How about shoving that stats in your stinking a$$hole?
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No I left it for you mom to clean up, she is busy cleaning the house.
I am actually sitting here with my hands between my head in amazement of how s.tupid you are. I gave you proof that your comment was wrong, not mine. Dude you should really catch a wakeup.
Let me give you some advise:
Put your finger as far as possible into your nose and put the cockroach back onto its little wheel, this will help your thinking.
Stop snorting so hard, actually use tissues to blow your nose, this will keep the cockroach from falling off.
Stop spitting, the movement makes the little cockroach fall off.
Try the above steps and you might start to think a little with the help of the cockroach. Never forget your little buddy, he sometimes fall off and need your help. All people without brains were given one of these. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
bytheway1
OK, if it's necessary why is the employment field still so unequal? What went wrong in 18 years?
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Many reasons; a lack of appetite, a lack of commitment, a lack of necessary support, etc.
By the way AA has not failed as you put it, if you understand structural objective it meant to address we have made serious strides, opened doors, etc but it is not enough. We need to grow the black middle class even more, make sure more people have access to opportunities and ironically this will address the question of education albeit indirectly.
We cannot stop AA now and simplistic reason like 18 years after democracy is not the solution as it misses the point completely.
Dzel - "look at how the NP leadership left the alliance after they were made the junior partner in the alliance."
Err... no. Thats not why the NNP left the DA and joined up with the ANC. They did it to try and change their image as a racially-aligned apartheid party. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
BlackSeed
SOLUTIONS
It means they are doing something right in that ward, simple as that.
You read too much newspaper. If DA cannot make sure that the ANC delivers in the Cape, how will they ensure service delivery in the whole country? Irrelevant of whether ANC runs those wards or not, DA need to show that they can defeat poverty incomparably.
That’s not the ANCs problem. DA should win votes easily if they are better than ANC.
Where and how many RDPs? Do they live in the RDP houses?
You work too much. Is that greed for money? Don’t you think they should hire someone to relieve you so you can go home and rest; tomorrow is another day. Yet you expect the ANC to create jobs when the likes of you work for more than 8hrs, for what? Give others a chance
You are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc.
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How was the DA formed kind sir?
OH FFS!! You really are a daft one indeed. the question YOU ASKED was answered. The DA was formed long before the floor crossing and shor alliance with the NNP just under a different name. You wouldnt know a fact if it hit you square in the face. You dont debate at all you supply your opinion without providing fact. thats not debating.
Floor crossing occured in all the political parties and in fact that is how the anc managed to win some wards. Legislation was introduced after the anc wooed members from other parties after that party won a seat and then it went to the anc after floor crossing. The MF did it with the anc and so did the NFP and we all know that the NNP jumped into bed to secure certain ministers posts. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
mkabayi
it's only by supporting a pan-africanist party, whose objective is the creation of a single, unitary african nation from cape to cairo, from morocco to madagascar that we africans can achieve genuine liberation and self-determination. the 'white core' from whose loins the DA comes and who are its chief 'brain' and sponsor are all too happy with the global status quo in which the west continues to dictate how people should live instead of minding their own business. the foreign european oppressor cannot see anything wrong with their kith and kin in the west who, after all, guarantee their very survival in africa.
the 'bigger picture' is directly relevant to our current problems. the reason why SA is undergoing de-industrialisation (and massive, INCREASING unemployment) to the extent that a simple t-shirt cant be profitably manufactured here and we soon would be importing basic food stuffs from 'lowest producer' countries through Walmart is because, on its own SA - and all african countries- are too weak to influence the rapacious greed coming with globalisation and the dictatorship of the market.
how will the DA, reduce inequality in SA (mainly race-based)and simultaneously create high-quality, sustainable employment for the majority? it can't. only within an economically and militarily strong, united africa can we decide on our own, which economic system best suites our 1 billion people. in terms of natural resources african is by far the wealthiest continent on earth.
(South Africa's rand weakened against the dollar after Moody's cut the government's bond rating by one notch to Baa1 from A3.
The ratings agency cited worries about the government's institutional strength and South Africa's investment climate and political stability. The credit outlook remains negative.)
So, I ask, what is this government doing for us South Africans. Whether you are black, white, indian, coloured, asian.. whatever.. You are screwed.
AA is not working bcos it only benefits those aligned with the leaders of the anc. AA was intended to advance the blacks due to reverse the effect apartheid had on blacks in the workplace. But we have a situation where blacks are put into positions merely bcos they are black and NOT neccessarily qualified for the position. Educating the youth adequately is more important than simply putting a person of color into a position just bcos they are a person of color. 18 years of democracy has dumbed down the education to a level where degrees are not worth they paper they are printed on, are easily forged and falsified. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
bytheway1
I surely believe that a growing black middle class will uplift our economy by strides, but just how does that have to do with a failed education system? On AA: My definition is - when equally qualified black and white apply for a job, the black person will get preference. My problem is that (maybe not always, but many times) a lessor qualified black gets the job... Just another question, for how long should AA be continued... taken that sometimes lack of drive etc. is reality. By the way, many white young folks also has lack of drive and ambition.
From PFP DP DA whateva they can evolve up to gates of HELL, these whites must just fcuk-off with DevolvedApartheid even under a new disguise!!
See them fighting for power !
But they know not the hour!
So they bribing with their guns, spare-parts and money!
Trying to belittle our Integrity now!!
They say what we know
Is just what they teach us!
And we're so ignorant!
'Cause every time they can reach us!
Through political strategy (Darnest damn new Political party?)
They keep us hungry (cheap labour @PnP Anglo American mines)!
And when you gonna get some food(AA BEE)!
Your brother got to be your enemy !
P.S Comrades these are lyrics by BMarley – “Ambush in the Night” . they can run around at nite having secret meeting to form new party to fight Balcks&anc but we know them!!
Helen Zille and Patricia de Lille starts the new party!
mazibuko takes the reigns of the DA and in 8 years they form an alliance.
Bang, you've got more of the population challenge the ANC. Easy.
Do properly what COPE fukked up. A valid solid party. No bullsh!te like the joke of COPE Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
SOLUTIONS
SOLUTIONS
It means they are doing something right in that ward, simple as that.
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You lost me on this one, so the anc is doing something right in that ward and that is why the people is now voting DA?
You read too much newspaper. If DA cannot make sure that the ANC delivers in the Cape, how will they ensure service delivery in the whole country? Irrelevant of whether ANC runs those wards or not, DA need to show that they can defeat poverty incomparably.
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It is not really the DA's work to make sure the anc must give service delivery, is that how you anc guys see it, if no one is looking I do not have to do my job. The DA created the most jobs in that province through making it the best run city in Africa, people want to invest and tourism is on the rise, tourism is one of your main incomes.
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That’s not the ANCs problem. DA should win votes easily if they are better than ANC.
Where and how many RDPs? Do they live in the RDP houses?
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Go and google for RDP houses build between the years that the anc was there and then go and check while the DA is there in the same amount of years. The DA is winning votes because people see they are the better party, it is just people who idiotically think that the DA want to bring back Apartheid that do not want to vote for them, fat boy malema is also one who spews this nonsense to his marginally thinking supporters.
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You work too much. Is that greed for money?
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No, I want to employ more people and support more schools, currently involved with a feeding program that feeds more than 1000 kids at school everyday for lunch. Money is a nice thing to have, it only makes your live easier, when you reached a point where you can pay yourself a salary that makes that you enjoy your surrounds it is time to give back.
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Don’t you think they should hire someone to relieve you so you can go home and rest; tomorrow is another day. Yet you expect the ANC to create jobs when the likes of you work for more than 8hrs, for what? Give others a chance
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LOL, I think you got it in the previous part of my comment, you really have no idea. Shame, Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again
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How will they split from SA like N and S Sudan? Do honestly belive that can happen in a democratic country? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
ILLUMINATED
@Dzel, Sin
That AA and Gender Equity shenanigans cost some of us big time. I still say people should be appointed based on merit and not colour or gender.
@Mapendana
Don't start with your feminist tendencies, it's not about gender or colour, get it into your head. It's about having the right credentials.
Well said. I think education is more important than AA. Just take a look at varsity entrance requirements and you will see that black students have a far lower entrance prerequisite than all the other races. Not only that places are reserved for black students only regardless of their grades. I heard on the radio from the University of Natal medical school that if they take 100 first year students 89 HAVE to be black. This is both unconstitutional as well as racist and it also eliminates students entering who are more deserving based on grades. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
Tasto
Get a fukken clue you racist git!! The DA fought against apartheid and the NP. Keep voting for your Another National Cockup and see what tune you will be singing in the near future, Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - Of course, all you would need is to have a referendum in the WCape, and if the majority vote in favour of the split, then WCape will be the newest country in the world. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - Isnt it ironic that you are singing Bob Marley songs about 'oppresive governments', even though you are governed by the ANC?
Through political strategy (Blaming apartheid, and using anti-white hate)
They keep us hungry (Lonmin mines, ANC board members, fuel prices, electricity prices (Hitachi))
And when you gonna get some food (Your fat politicians aint lookin hungry)
Your brother got to be your enemy (Your fellow South African) Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!
Of course, all you would need is to have a referendum in the WCape, and if the majority vote in favour of the split
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The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums, because of the racial canotations it has, so that will not happen. Also Wcape is bot seperate from any province it falls withun the confines of the SA constitution. The ruling party can rule on reducing the province if that is observed by the constitution. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
ILLUMINATED - "That AA and Gender Equity shenanigans cost some of us big time. I still say people should be appointed based on merit and not colour or gender."
Of course, people should be appointed on merit and not colour. But lets have a look at the state of education in the country. If we had to implement people based on education, then all companies would be 90% white. So of course, the poor excuse of colour is brought in again.
Meanwhile, we have incompetent directors running state parastatals. We have playwrights running youth agencies. We have cleaning ladies posing as MP of the military. We have dudes with BA degrees running the higher institutions of South Africa. We have a president who didnt even pass highschool.
And these deployees are costing us billions. Denel, Eskom, Transet, SAA all required bailouts. The board of SAA just resigned?
We are not even speaking of the gap between grade 12 and 1st year students. This is reality regardless race! I also agree with you on 'reservation for blacks', since one of my friends were turned down due to this, even though he had excellent grades. Again, I reiterate, let the deserving ones get it, then maybe the lessor deserving ones will be working harder to deserve. Report Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo - "The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums"
Yeah it does. What racial problem does the constitution have with referendums?
According to the constitution chapter 14, section 235, the Cape is entitled to statehood if it so chooses. Article 1 of the United Nations Charter and various UN general assembly resolutions dealing with sovereignty and independence. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
@MorenaWaPolelo - don't entertain Volkstaat in any guise DA is ebd of racist rightwingers that fact that is why Zille want a clean slate!!
Tango - My real name is "Jou ma" and my surname is a word sowetan blocks :P Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
ANC at Mangaung must cleanse itself new leadership
Resolve to do away with provinces
Speed up up genuine transformation for 18 years tried to push reconciliation and got what at the end ARROGANT racist whites, they can emmigrate who cares they been singing the same song since 1994 who can blame them THEY still play Elvis Presely songs in this age as if its an in fashion!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
The DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.
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Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - "The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums"
Yeah it does. What racial problem does the constitution have with referendums?
According to the constitution chapter 14, section 235, the Cape is entitled to statehood if it so chooses. Article 1 of the United Nations Charter and various UN general assembly resolutions dealing with sovereignty and independence
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That normaly happens in countries that are not governable so your Wcape does not qualify!!! Report Abuse
ha ha ha ha ha ha guys am so in lav with dis debate but to cam to an end of it ,,,,, what is da best solution for all of dis,,,,,according to my little knowl,,,,,, nometa wat we do or try our country is not going to change for wat it is ,,,, we will die instead complaining, wishing, for nothing
every1 nid to fyt for him/her self rada dan cracking your mynds abt apartheid,,, and wat i know poverty is not going to end either we lyk it or not,,,,,
and even if we rule by a men or women,either white,black or blue,,, he/ she neva eva change dis country,,,,can one of you guys tell me how many human beings in dis country and you guys still having more babies and you think our govament is going to handly dis situation hell no in our dreams ,,,,,, our country is not going to change for wat it is
either we vote for a billionare or zillionare,millionare even imikhukhu will neva eva iphele so stop cracking your mynds with ................... or else you are bored guys even hellen can have anada party dat will make no diff,,, even me i can have my own party wat you think guys LOLMENTTTTTTTTTT
Hey, enough now. How about we open our own political party? mmmmmmmmh? We know what we want for this country so stop blahbaring and let see if u have what it takes. Only those who want progress not those who want to dwell in the past. Those who will let the past to be history and make their own by puting this country on the map for the good reason. Anyone interested? @ !Sinudeity! do not worry people are more wiser now, we have past the black and white hatred but we are here to see the rainbow nation growing for better. Zille for President! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
The DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.
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Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down.
Crooks where exactly dude? They not incompetent but realise coalitions are neede to get rid of the anc due to their blind followers. Incompetence has 3 letters A N C!! Malema is only popular in the press. They said 15000 would hold avigil for Juju before his court appearance and yet 2000 showed up, mostly school chilrend that were bused in to falsify his true support. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - Nah, its not about governance, in the SA constitution its based self-determination of any community sharing a common cultural and language heritage. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
!Sinudeity!
DA-DBN-GUY - It was more like 600 people that pitched. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
!Sinudeity!
DA-DBN-GUY - It was more like 600 people that pitched
Even better, just quoting an article I read. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
madimetsha
Zille has seen a gap in SA politics, we do really need an alternative to ANC and DA, poeple vote for ANC as loyalty for liberating the country, people vote for DA becuase it gave them what they have, people vote for COPE becuase they are angry with ANC, people vote for APC becuase they madwith IFP, so we basically vote based on history,which is emotions as we feel some sense of loyalty or anger, hence closer to voting times we get reminded how apartheid was, and a few promises about the future, which never materialise , we need political parties which will be be about now and the future. where we will change the landscape of politics as opposed to the traitional political system. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Tasto
Comrades go to yr community structures amataverns stokvels funerals raise the issue of provinces\bantustans.ANC must remove them Zille would be reduces to an ordinary howler in Parliament just tha!! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
xBusi
@Tasto
There might be "white racists bloggers" like you call them, but that does not detract from the fact that you are a black racist blogger. Stop focusing on colour the whole time and focus on the issues at hand. The issue is that Zille thinks a new party could challenge the ANC... It has nothing to do with race, but rather about policy and delivery! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
The DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.
==========
Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down.
Crooks where exactly dude? They not incompetent but realise coalitions are neede to get rid of the anc due to their blind followers. Incompetence has 3 letters A N C!! Malema is only popular in the press. They said 15000 would hold avigil for Juju before his court appearance and yet 2000 showed up, mostly school chilrend that were bused in to falsify his true support.
=========================
Why dont they implement such coalitions in DA to better their political stand than suggesting formation of new part that will tackel ANC out of power?
How do the DA for a coalition with themselves? A coalition is between other parties is it not? A new party may be seen as being a non white only party as the DA is being made out to be now. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
When this party comes about you will see some anc "constituitionalists" joining and there increasing their credibility. Dr Mamphele, hope I spelt it right, or even Thabo Mbheki's brother would be the ideal candidate to lead the new Party Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
How do the DA for a coalition with themselves? A coalition is between other parties is it not? A new party may be seen as being a non white only party as the DA is being made out to be now.
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Okay! in that one they'll have to come and join ANC(black community party) to make the needed coalition they are talking about.
What do you think,that will bring new minds that Helen wishes to see?
I think no politician should be in charge of delivery. The skills required to be a politician and the skill required to organise and ensure delivery is fundamentally different.
As long as we are hoping for any political party to "rescue" us, we will sit idle and dream.
Hellen obviously wants those within the anc that uphold the constitution and not the powermongers that crave power. the latter are the ones that spread racist rhetoric and the ghost of apartheid at every turn. We cant move forward if we are always looking back and are ruled by corrupt leaders Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
xBusi
@Tasto
I am not supporting any party here. I am commenting on the fact that you point fingers but in many ways you are what you seem to hate.
The fact that a rudderless party rules SA and continues to do so, says something about the intelligence of the voters though! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
Hellen obviously wants those within the anc that uphold the constitution and not the powermongers that crave power. the latter are the ones that spread racist rhetoric and the ghost of apartheid at every turn. We cant move forward if we are always looking back and are ruled by corrupt leaders.
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She must go and get them.lol
In 2014 the will FYL and NFP which can both overtake DA as the opposition Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Respect10
Zille said the historical roots of the current political parties were making it difficult for them to challenge the dominant position of the ANC alone.
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1st reason that will make it hard for DA to take over ANC
2. DA is always complaining about ANC thinking that most of us do not understand politics, ppl do not really want to hear about complains but what are you going to do for them, ( Obama won the USA elections on telling people what they wanted to hear, something they wanted, change and he never saw race as an obstacle to his dream and the dream of thse ppl. he was not much into complaining of all the things that the rulling party was doing.
3. The other problem with DA is that they want to win black votes and I blv any party that goes with that strategy won't succeed,
4 I usually tell people is not about the RACE but how you sell your product to ppl (ANC has the thing that whites won't vote for a black party and white blv blacks wont vote for a white party, sell ur ideas and c, Obama sold his ideas and were bought by every1 black n whites)
5 DA was formed as a come back political party
Tango
In 2014 the will FYL and NFP which can both overtake DA as the opposition
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Neither will exist by then! Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
How was the DA formed kind sir?
OH FFS!! You really are a daft one indeed. the question YOU ASKED was answered. The DA was formed long before the floor crossing and shor alliance with the NNP just under a different name. You wouldnt know a fact if it hit you square in the face. You dont debate at all you supply your opinion without providing fact. thats not debating.
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See this is what I hate debating against, completely clueless yet indignant in your ignorance.
Floor-crossing was requested formally by the then DP and NP so they could form an alliance that is now known as DA. The ANC acceded to that request, the constitution was amended accordingly and floor crossing became a reality in 2003 and all 8 seats then held by the NP moved over to the DP or DA as it became known.
Want proof:
History
Floor crossing legislation was initially requested by the Democratic Partyand the New National Party in November 2001, as a means of formalising their unification into the Democratic Alliance. The African National Congress, which held the power in the legislature to change the constitution, did not favour the measure at the time, as they perceived the DA initiative to be a "congealing of a race and class based political opposition".[9] However, when the NNP leadership announced their desire to leave the DA and form alliances with the ANC in 2001, the ANC passed the legislation. ANC chairman Mosiuoa Lekota stated that the party's reasons for the legislation was "for some political realignment…and the break-up of racial power blocks".[9]
Of course I wouldn't have to go through all this trouble if you knew what you are talking about but alas, I have to explain yet again what you should know.
The "complaining" you say the DA do is not complaining but trying to keep the anc honest. The anc has tried to undermine the constitution numerous times and the DA as the opposition has a duty to set them straight. The DA do try and say what they will do for the people but are called a racist, elitist white party with coconuts. have yet to hear the DA use racist tactics to win votes. The DA had always been around but just known by different names. The anc doesnt have a product only its history as a liberation movement that it uses to play the guilt card to ensure the previously disadvantaged carry on voting for them. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
AA is not working bcos it only benefits those aligned with the leaders of the anc. AA was intended to advance the blacks due to reverse the effect apartheid had on blacks in the workplace. But we have a situation where blacks are put into positions merely bcos they are black and NOT neccessarily qualified for the position.
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Only benefits those that are aligned to the ANC, how do you figure that out?
Does the ANC sit on interview panels; your logic is all over the place. You don’t seem to understand AA, its implementation and its flaws, by bringing ANC into AA you expose your ignorance.
I keep on asking how old you guys are not because age is important but your views are so naive you can only be young and impressionable to make the kind of statements you guys make. If an unqualified individual is placed in a position of power then that is not AA, it is window-dressing and is bound to fail. That is not what AA is about, it would help if you understood this fact.
DA-DBN-GUY May I ask why you debate on this website. Is it to exchange views and opinion, to learn from others, to preach or to stroke your ego?
That question is important because you miss the point of engaging in a debate public or otherwise and we now seem to be debating to win debates rather than share information and decide which position or argument makes sense. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
Dzel
Then obviously you too dont understand AA. AA means placing a previously disadvantaged person into a advertised position above a white person if they have similar qualifications and experience. I know of companies that HAVE to appoint a black person into certain positions regardless. AA is also used to make companies BEE compliant. This is an anc policy. This goes for municipalities as well as the private sector. AA is an anc policy Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
The "complaining" you say the DA do is not complaining but trying to keep the anc honest. The anc has tried to undermine the constitution numerous times and the DA as the opposition has a duty to set them straight. The DA do try and say what they will do for the people but are called a racist, elitist white party with coconuts. have yet to hear the DA use racist tactics to win votes.
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Please expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY May I ask why you debate on this website. Is it to exchange views and opinion, to learn from others, to preach or to stroke your ego?
That question is important because you miss the point of engaging in a debate public or otherwise and we now seem to be debating to win debates rather than share information and decide which position or argument makes sense.
I hopefully try and learn as i am open minded but at times it is difficult when one encounters another who doesnt provide facts to their "debates' but merely opinions and then tries to rubbish off others who provide facts. Asking a persons age is not a valid debating tool neither is sarcasm. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
Then obviously you too dont understand AA. AA means placing a previously disadvantaged person into a advertised position above a white person if they have similar qualifications and experience.
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Yes that is the de.finition but do you und.erstand the log.ic be.hind AA and what it tries to ac.hieve?
Hardy, sowetan does not provide clues as to what is vulgar or not so I had to shy away from your method.
I meant DA must be doing something right for them to win votes; similar to why ANC is keeping votes don’t you think?
Then why is the DA opposition? Why do they want to topple ANC if they don’t have to ensure that ANC delivers?
As for calling people idiots, I’ll leave you with that self-inflicted frustration; unfortunately there’s nothing I can do other than advising you not to call people idiots when they don’t agree with you. I didn’t want to Google since you have answers but I guess I thought wrong, besides, I don’t just trust literature.
I give thanks to your good heart for sharing healthy food with the hungry, so long as it’s not for vanity.
We all need a rest after slavery. More hours of work will only keep those children hungry when you can’t wake up anymore because of hard work. A rest is needed, even the Gods rests.
DZEL
Please expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
The anc play the race card every election without fail. You had JM calling whites thieves at the last municipal election, the anc accusing the DA of sabotaging their campaign in Soweto, accused the DA of using a speech by Trvor Manuel out of context to garner more votes, the anc altering a DA poster and having it in the back ground during an interview on tv and the list goes on.
I do understand the log ic behind it and dont have a problem with it IF it were implemented correctly which it is not. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
Dzel is confusing AA and cadre deployment Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
come sit on my lap and i will tell you about cadre deployment which dzel is trying to muggle up with aa and bee. you see the party currently in power takes the dumbest freak it can get its hands on and then forces an entity to make him a director or ceo, even though he needs help tying his own shoes. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
I hopefully try and learn as i am open minded but at times it is difficult when one encounters another who doesnt provide facts to their "debates' but merely opinions and then tries to rubbish off others who provide facts. Asking a persons age is not a valid debating tool neither is sarcasm.
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Firstly age is important as it is an indicator of one's experiences, experience and knowledge. The younger one is the more likely they are to be naive which certainly is the case when discussing our past.
Also we need to be very careful of how we define "facts", posting a wikipedia li.nk does not amount to providing facts so comprehending what is a fact and what isn't is important. Sometimes a debate should be based on analysis of a situation or a document, by definition analysis can never be fact as it is essentially an opinion as you correctly state. You've asked me to provide proof that the DA is anti-AA, obviously there is no document that states this outright but breaking down official DA policy coupled with an understanding of what AA is and what it seeks to address it is not difficult to surmise the DA is not genuine about their hijacked version as it seeks to undermine the very intention of the concept.
I'd trust you are intelligent enough to understand that fact, because of apartheid being race based any solution to reverse the impact thereof must be along the very same racial lines and if we measure success we have to look at whether the standard and quality of life amongst the designated group is improving. Any thing else is not AA, telling me I should be converted by this non-racial concept defeats the very idea behind AA.
Of course education is important but don't insult our collective intelligence by arguing that education should replace AA, only the naive and unassuming would buy that line and the DA stinks we are stupid enough to believe anything and everything they tell us.
Dzel -- hahahaha!!! so there is no facts that the da is against bee/aa so therefore we just have to analyse and make up stories as we gio along, yirre this oake cracks me up Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
I do understand the log ic behind it and dont have a problem with it IF it were implemented correctly which it is not.
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No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
Don't claim you understand the objective, explain it to me so I can see if you really understand the objectives.
Even if you do can you discuss the impact of rising income within communities with any degree of intelligence?
Do you think AA should be scrapped and why? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- hahahaha! for someone who says we should be careful how we define "facts" you sure type the word "fact" along with the beeskak you write Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
Dzel --
No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
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yirre boet, its only stupid people that say education isnt important Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
HFVerwoerd
Dzel --
No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
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yirre boet, its only stupid people that say education isnt important
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Stop making an idiot of yourself and improve your comprehension skills, maybe then I will give you the attention you so desperately want.
there is no document that states this outright but breaking down official DA policy coupled with an understanding of what AA is and what it seeks to address it is not difficult to surmise the DA is not genuine about their hijacked version as it seeks to undermine the very intention of the concept.
So then this is your opinion and not a fact so therefeore your point is mute? As I have already said I am not anti AA just the way it is being implemented and seemingly only benefitting those with ties to the anc, in municipal circles that is, I dont think I said education should replace AA merely stating that it is more important than AA. Because without adequate education AA will always fail. You should feel your "collective intelligence" is being insulted by a regime that says it is doing well and uplifting the country. Dude it is the anc that thinks you are stupid bcos you, not meaning you personally, keep voting for them regardless how they continue to fail the country.
Do you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
Dzel -- jirre boet, jys maar lekker evasive ne, laat my dink aan n nat onderbroek - are you also a tenderpreneur? cause you have to be as dum as a plank for that job - or you are window dressing? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
Please expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
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Does putting a black face on a poster with the sole intention that the electorate will identify with the race of that said individual and vote for the said party not qualify as racist. Is this not racial profiling and isn't racial profile racist by definition?
this dezel fellow seems to be the only one that is talking fallacy but calls it fact -- jirrie boet you must work for government Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
Do you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
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Has the black-middle class not grown since '94, you know what marketers call black diamonds. What do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class and is it made of of ANC cadres as you think?
Dzel -- what do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class
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merely the removal of apartheid guy the current black middle class are the people that are go getters and that made it themselves - did you honestly think the anc got there there? no boet Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
Dzel
HF
I am not in the habit of entertaining idiots, from what you've posted here and judging by your nick you come across as a Class A idiot. Consider this the first and last response directed at you unless you grow up very quickly. People like you dispel the myth that whites are intellectually superior.
We shou.ld ha.ve po.litical par.ties who put the coun.tries fut.ure before who le.ads it at M.angaung.
The D.A has made it cle.ar what it is all about. It wis.hes to use f.ree market prin.cipals & bet.ter educ.ation to get to an e.conomic gr.owth of 8% whic.h is requir.ed to make any signific.ant cha.nge in the stan.dard of livi.ng of all South Africans.
A.A and BE.E have f.ailed m.iserably. because both polic.ies did not cr.eate any new jo.bs or busine.sses. This is why our u.nemployment has stag.nated over the past 10 years. The ANC is good at blam.ing A.partheid and the Global c.risis of 2008 but really they should si.t dow.n and look and see that they have never ado.pted polic.ies that would cause the pri.vate sec.tor to gr.ow fa.st eno.ugh to see a differ.ence in the tri.ple c.risis we liv.e in. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY
Do you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
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Has the black-middle class not grown since '94, you know what marketers call black diamonds. What do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class and is it made of of ANC cadres as you think?
Indeed it has grown and yes it is certainly made up of cadres. Here in KZN we hve the Mpisanes who form obscurity suddenly became rich over night thanks to Shawns mother being in the DBN municipality and getting her daughter lucrative tenders despite the fact she was blacklisted for fraud. Look at the Aurora mine owners. Connected to Zoomer and Madiba. Coincidence? Doubt it. Roux Shabangu being offered deals despite not always being the cheapest.
"Does putting a black face on a poster with the sole intention that the electorate will identify with the race of that said individual and vote for the said party not qualify as racist"
Please enlighten me if you can how the above can be construed as racist? Doesnt calling a certain race thieves classify as racist? Report Abuse
So then this is your opinion and not a fact so therefeore your point is mute?
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Logic my friend, can you analyse and reason through an idea until you reach a logical conclusion?
My point is not moot, I don't need an official document to validate its soundness, you are welcome to give alternative analysis but you too are still to explain how this need-based AA will work in reality cause you can't.
As much as I don't have reasons to vote for the ANC I have no reasons to vote for the DA because they do not take me as an individual and a black person seriously instead they think putting up a picture of Lindiwe will convince me, do you even comprehend how insulting that assumption is?
It says I am stupid, brainless and only see in colour. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- so boet i dont have any documents as proof but using logic i can deduce that the ruling party and all its leaders are all baby-killing satanists who sacrifice virgins? and i dont need any factious evidence to validate its soundness? seems like you were the type of guy at school who wants everyone to debate but as soon as you dont agere with him then he storms off am i right? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- and are you trying to tell us that the black middle class are so useless that they couldnt have made it without bee or aa? Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
DZEL
Please tell me how having a pic of Lindiwe on a DA poster is racist. Dying to hear your reasoning.
AA will never work bcos the anc have used it to benefit their cadres and friends, in government, and not the collective. AA will only work if you pit qualification and or experience against each other. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
DZEL
You would rather see Lindiwe and all other black reps in the DA as window dressing based on your assumptions rather than focus on the FACT that they were elected into their respective positions. You are close minded and see the DA as "white" when in fact the FACTS show otherwise. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
HFVerwoerd
DA-DBN-GUY - Janee boet, lindiwe as window dressing meanwhile we have all these ceos and directors in the state companies who are nothing more but window dressing and cost us millions and then we get the inefitable golden handshake at the end of their term what is all this drama with SABC now? the company is bankrupt cant even show local sports games, all the management are being charged for corruption but they all receive golden handshakes and dzel is going on about window dressing. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
The-Rothschilds
Dzel
HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- and are you trying to tell us that the black middle class are so useless that they couldnt have made it without bee or aa?
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Of course it completely es.capes you that Afrik.aners had their own version of AA and BEE stretching back to '48 only they called it apa.rtheid.
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You are basing your assumption on the fact that black people had companies before apartheid of which the apartheid government forced those companies to hire white people, which is completely not true. No jobs were stolen from black people, the white people created their jobs.
AA today is just an excuse law to force white people to give up their jobs. Report Abuse
Sep 28, 2012
The-Rothschilds
AA and BEE are failed policies and are election ploys to gather votes.
They dont make economic sense but make political sense for the political party proposing such laws.
However, without economic sense as Julius Malema would say, renders political sense useless. Report Abuse
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Comments
Afrojoy
I'm glad Zille has finally come to realise that the majority of South Afric*ns who happen to be bl*ck are not yet ready for a wh*te dominated party, whose supporters are mostly w*ites. You only need to go to N.E.W.S.2.4 to read the raci*l vitriol spewed by DA's wh*te supporters towards bl*cks. This vitriol has not done any good but alianate the bl*ck liberal middle class who would have otherwise been easily swayed to join the DA ranks. The DA's failure in Cape town to address welfare issues in areas like Khayelitsha coupled with the open t*ilets and f*reigners from EC fiasco, dents its reputation as a broad national opposition party. What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way.Report Abuse
langman
I have been blind all my life voting for this useless anc . This time around I will vote for Hellen zilleReport Abuse
langman
Surely I have lost confidence in black leadersReport Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Afrojoy - If people had to vote for a party based on its supporters, then nobody would vote for the ANC. You complain about news[24], well you should read the sowetan comments :PAs for the black middleclass, they are the highest demographic of voters that have been switching over to the DA. 1.5 million voters in the last election.
Been calling for a new opposition party for years now... Still waiting...
Report Abuse
warry
Helen be patient you build a good party on good foundation, you might not rule now but the party will in futureReport Abuse
Shredder
@Afrojoy - What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way.===============================================
True. The ANC is mess up the country and keep on blaming apartheid for everything. Yes, apartheid has left a huge economic gap between blacks and whites. Having said that, the ANC is busy leaving out the well working structures that were developed by the apartheid government. SABC, SAA, etc. Schools that were built are now being closed. We can't afford more mess. We need a strong opposition party.
Report Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
Zille the is noway I see this happening with due respect mam, the leaders in all political parties are power hungry like you, there is also a racial devide. If this party you are proposing as lead by you or any white person it is simply going to alienate black people. The only way that this can work is for black people to form the party in question and you and all the mickey mouse parties join in!!! It will not guarantee you a win but it will give you a chance in every polls. Ms Zille do ot allow your support in Cape Town cloud you the are a lot of black people who ha.te you and white people with a passion and even if they agree with your views just because they come from you their hatred blocks everything. I admire your ambition madam and in GP we have Jack the clown Bloom who normaly has interesting things to say!!! But pity like you he is white and the hatred blacks have for white people defeats his intensions...GOODLUCKReport Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
AfrojoyWhat's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way
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That is correct, what this country needs is the anything but the ANC type of party driven by blacks not associated with anyone COSATU, bloody SACP, DA, the circus COPE ect....
Report Abuse
Tango
The will be a new party after MangaungReport Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
TangoThe will be a new party after Mangaung
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Correct!!!!!!
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DJ-Winner
ha ha ha ha...Thanks for admiting that your party has failed.....Report Abuse
Flemza
Please madam Helen Zille is this another DA again you are planning to form, why are you advocating your personnal opion as a DA leader , please leave us alone to die with ANC with Zuma as ots leader and leader of the country , the whole country except a pocket few love Zuma hence Zuma and ANC are ruling the country and the country is progressing even though the whole world had rescession , but Zuma leadership saved us from the worst , so please madam don`t confuse usReport Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
Flemzaso please madam don`t confuse us
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How can you be confsed by a sewer pipe dream!!!
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Cl!ck-
ANC will govern this country until Jesus Christ of Nazareth returns..Report Abuse
asaowe
I think Madam is being economical wth da truth, she foresee loosing to Lindiwe DA leadership battle and she cannot subject herself under Lindiwe leadership as being blacklady, and for DA wl lose more whte votes once Lindiwe take over because it would seem black might be majority in future within DA upper structure, i might be wrong guys plz dont cruxify me.Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
Well no sh!t Mrs Zille... How did you come to that conclusion? Sometimes, no scratch that, all the time I wonder if politicians think all the people are ignorant zealots with no upper brain functions. It makes the political system cheap and vapid.Report Abuse
Cl!ck-
@ asaoweLindiwe is not that "BIG"..
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Tango
That new party will end up like Cope.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The DA is winning. The ANC is losing. Your party lost its 2/3 majority, and will never get it back again. In all the contested by-elections (Except KZN), the DA won all the wards.Report Abuse
Cl!ck-
@ MorenaWaPoleloWhen I watched the President's speech, I only saw Lindiwe amongst the audience.. But then again, reporters claim it was full..
Well actually, you've got a point there!..
Lindiwe is HUUUGGGGEEEEE...
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!DJ-Winner - The DA is winning. The ANC is losing. Your party lost its 2/3 majority, and will never get it back again. In all the contested by-elections (Except KZN), the DA won all the wards
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Never say never!!!
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KingOfHearts
Zille is right, a new party is needed.in its formation i hope they do not make the same mistake cope made, which was to appeal on peoples rational over emotions. ANC wins votes because people are still voting with emotions over rational. to this day, some people when they vote for ANC, they vote for Mandela and not the ANC. Majority of South Africans are still bitter about the past and showing people that your party played a major role in the liberation struggle will sure win you votes. Parties like cope however came out criticizing communism and socialism.How many south africans actually know what that is?that was the downfall of Thabo Mbeki as well when he started pushing people into rationalising politics. thats is why Malema finds people to support him, because he appeal to their emotions over rational.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - What has the ANC done to win back its 2/3 majority? Delivered services? Improved education or healthcare in the country? What about transparency? Has it reduced corruption?Report Abuse
THEmadame2B-BBEE
for some odd reason i find comments here depressing, maybe i should log out for goodReport Abuse
Dzel
There is that word gain, non-racialism which basically means the "new party" must pretend we never had apartheid or that we still suffer effects thereof.How do you propose the formation of a new party then list "non-negotiables" before even dialogue has started. Zille wants other parties to merge with the DA on her terms which is disturbing and self-serving.
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Shredder
@Cl!ck-ANC will govern this country until Jesus Christ of Nazareth returns..
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Click, with due respect, Malema said we must not mix politics with religion. He said this thing of people saying the ANC will rule until Jesus Christ comes back is not on because Jesus Christ has not come back, but the ANC lost power in Western Cape and Midvaal. He says such people should not be trusted.
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!MorenaWaPolelo - What has the ANC done to win back its 2/3 majority? Delivered services? Improved education or healthcare in the country? What about transparency? Has it reduced corruption?
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Your correct Sin!! the things that you mentioned are not attended to the satifactory of every one, but the electorate in this country does not vote based on only that.. the voting in this country is based on colour boet and you must be naive to think that will change in 2014/15. The more the ANC sits on the right in parly there more they will have a crack at fixing all the things you mentioned!!!
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NwanaPhiri
so who takes over when zille steps aside ?and i cant help but wonder, will the DA still win as much votes from whites if a black person is in charge?
i think she (zille) took all ths into consideration and decided a new political party was the way to go !
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Mothata
I think Afrojoy is right, for DA to get more black voters who still think that the DA is a white party they must just put Lindiwe as their President.Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
It saddens me to look at the comments to the top and see that there is people who is happy with the way the anc is running the country to the ground.Please don't say we must not worry because December is on its way and change is going to happen, we have been hearing this for years.
It is just a proven fact that all liberation parties failed, it is time for the DA to take over and make the whole of SA to work as good as Cape Town.
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Ratshufi
reason why the whole thing is called politics.i stopped worrying my self with bullshit
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Hail
Way to go Zellie! we cannot keep going backwards to blame apartheid instead of moving forward and develop our own country to be able to compite globally. Where I work you have over 50 votes when I include my family and friends you going towards 100. Basotho ga ba kgone! they have proved that for the past 18yrs.I mean up to now we still do not know where we going as a country! All the 1994 promise they not even on quarter of their list in order to fulfill it. Ke kgale re dikoloha thaba so it is time to change direction.Report Abuse
Fhatu
Am not happy with the services that ANC is giving us , But cant vote for DA .Report Abuse
Silo4G
The party is already there.It is called Friends of the Youth League!!
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hell
I have not decided of which party to vote, for in the next coming election.If there can be a party on their manifesto includes scraping of the unjust E-tolling, you have my Vote. I am tired of ANC. They are not listen to the people, but claims to represent us.
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DJ-Winner
MothataI think Afrojoy is right, for DA to get more black voters who still think that the DA is a white party they must just put Lindiwe as their President.
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Mangosuthu_, Lekota_ and Bantu_ are all black, but we don't vote for them. The blackout strategy will not work. People will continue to vote for ANC...
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Ntsalake
ANC is not doing good, but to vote for DA eix...Report Abuse
Ratshufi
@hellI have not decided of which party to vote, for in the next coming election.
If there can be a party on their manifesto includes scraping of the unjust E-tolling, you have my Vote. I am tired of ANC. They are not listen to the people, but claims to represent us.
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Dude i am with you on that one i dont really know if there is any party out there thats worth my vote
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Shredder
I am not happy with how the ANC is running the country. Eish!! I guess I have to take my chances with the madam (DA).Report Abuse
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.Report Abuse
oldlady12
BTW, who else thinks this is a call for JM?Report Abuse
Ratshufi
@oldlady12DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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i am impressed ....so now you realise you have been used just like we are used now by our own ANC
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MorenaWaPolelo
oldlady12DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that
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Good but you understand why black dont vote DA?
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NwanaPhiri
DJ - WINNERno, they wont. white people wont vote for a black person. only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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smart move by zille, very strategic...
well, she remains a politician, at the end of the day its about power, white as she may be...
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Silo4G
@oldlady12Who else thinks this is a call for JM?
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Julias Malema is already leading Friends of the Youth League and they are trying to challenge the ruling ANC.
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MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhirismart move by zille, very strategic
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strategic???? you must be confused at the meaning of the word!!
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asaowe
Is she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl.Report Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
asaoweIs she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl.
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I see this as here admiting that the party she leads does not stand a chance!!!
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Tango
DA LEADER Helen Zille - who is standing for another term as party leader---------------------------------------
When are they having their own Mangaung and who is challenging her?
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spirro
HELLEN SHUTUP YOU WILL DO THE SAME IF YOU WIN THE ELECTION,ALL POLITICIANS ARE CORRUPT YOU ARE THE SAME SO STOP PLAYING THE BLAME GAME HERE YOUR NOT A SAINT, AND IF IT HAPPEN YOYU WIN THE ELECTION YOU WILL BITCH LIKE NEVER BEFOR SO SHUTUP.Report Abuse
DJ-Winner
asaoweIs she admiting that DA has failed, jst a question ppl.
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Yes...
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Shredder
@oldlady12BTW, who else thinks this is a call for JM?
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Good thought that can not be ignored. However, Julius is a racist(from his talks) I don't foresee him merging with whites :-D. Anyway, people do change, I think Julius would do anything to get rid of JZ, even merging with whites is possible.
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DJ-Winner
oldlady12DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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LeparaThePresident
Guys i read ,most of your comments. Though there is still parallel line between wh!tes and bL@cks i can see that there is a general consensus that the ruling party is directionless and ineptitude. I think madam Zille is just spoofing the politcal arena hoping that there are still NP members who wants to join them. The fact is, madam Zille knows that she cannot have AZAPO,PAC,SOPA, as her branded co-join party and she knows that the so called parties like FF,ACDP<UDM<IFP> GODI 's party, and most recntly formed party COPE to be on her lead. Everyone wants to eat, and they have hallucinations of becoming RSA President.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - "Tell that to your president. She is thinking about opening a new whites only party."And where did she say this? And people wonder why you always get your facts wrong :P
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cornelius
Such a move is long overdue. To the sceptics : Zille's utterances should prove to you that the DA is not intent on being a " whit.e" party that serves " wh.ite " interests. It is obvious that a party that is strong enough to defeat the ANC will have a majority of bl.ack members. She is not insisiting on being the leader of that party, please people, don't make up things. The leader can be a bl.ack person. It is Zille who is nurturing Lindiwe for bigger things - you people are obsessed with ra.ce.@DZEL - I can hardly believe your comments. Clearly there has to be a commitment to certain core values, otherwise you are lumping together people who have no common goals, ideology. Jir sir, try to be objective,
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bytheway1
We should not judge a group of people by the comments of a few big mouth cowards, sitting behind a desk cyberspace away from a klap. Unfortunately it is true that blacks see the DA as a white party and I believe they (DA) should have done more to develop and place black leaders... since there are strong ones out there. Maybe they should have focused more on strategically aligning their party, instead of trying to do the ruling party's work. As for Mazibuko... In my circle of friends and family she is pretty much liked, because she is articulate, intelligent and do not have to read speeches, but can actually give one. One should be realistic with racial divide, since I think there will always be in any social situation around the world in any country. What we should realize is that it is the minority who is usually far right and that we have a lot more in common in terms of expectations and dreams than we realize. We have good people among us across all races and I still believe that the latter constitutes the majority of us. People should realize that apartheid, as it was, will never be back. Unfortunately, due to ignorance and reckless politics a new apartheid is born, which is totally unnecessary and uncalled for.Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
DJ-Winnero, they won't. White people won't vote for a black person. Only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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Stop generalizing, do you know how many white people voted anc before?
All people should vote for any competent person, you are just to d.umb to notice this.
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!Sinudeity!
So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote.Report Abuse
NwanaPhiri
MorenaWapolelostrategy???? you must be confused at the meaning of the word
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a strategy is a plan of action designed to achieve a specific goal. strategy is all about gaining a position of advantage over adversaries or best exploiting emerging posibilities.
@MorenaWapolelo, try and link the above with my previous two comments.
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote
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You can not tell people not to vote you must ecourage people to vote Sir!!!
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DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
o, they won't. White people won't vote for a black person. Only those with business connections for their own benefits...
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Stop generalizing, do you know how many white people voted anc before?
All people should vote for any competent person, you are just to d.umb to notice this.
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They did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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Dzel
cornelius,@DZEL - I can hardly believe your comments. Clearly there has to be a commitment to certain core values, otherwise you are lumping together people who have no common goals, ideology. Jir sir, try to be objective
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Those core value would have to be proposed, debated and ratified by those who seek to participate in this new party, correct?
What gives Zille the right to list these values and state them as non-negotiables as if she has a god-given right to dictate terms to others?
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DJ-Winner
!Sinudeity!So, if you are unhappy with the ANC, but dont want to vote DA, just dont vote.
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People will continue to vote for ANC and take to the streets for their demands. It's the only way to do things these days. ANC listens to demands, unlike your DA that goes to the court to prevent people from striking...
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Mgaraji
You must have been born after 94 to believe white people once voted for the ANC. During Mandela's presidency white were worst grumblers most emigrated during that time. Caucasians stated to over praise Mandela as a means to undermine Mbeki, as if they loved Mandela when he was president.We are coerced to believe 94 generation is the most cleverest generation ever when they also suffer from the legacy of apartheid. Like it or not apartheid will be blamed till the end of time. Few successful blacks nursing their boardroom & neighbourhood relationship with the caucasians are irritated if apartheid is blamed.
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!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - "Read between the lines."You mean, make up your own bull$h17 as you go along.
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cornelius
@Dzel - the DA is the main opposition, and the strongest by far. She surely has the right to state what she considers to be non negotiables. I am pretty sure that you won't be able find fault with thoses, and will also recognise that they are precisely what is lacking in the present government. Cast aside your sceptimism Dzel and join the future !Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :PReport Abuse
mhlupheki
i have heared about the looming merger between cope and da, and after Mangaung they will be joined by malema's camp. i mean the economic freedom fighters. i dont see us loosing in Mangaung even with single vote. we will be celebrating as ussuall and that will be the birth of new baby that will fade like cope.Report Abuse
Mgaraji
mkabayiso the DA does admit now that they dont have any hope in hell of attracting the majority of African voters? SA cannot separate itself from the politics of ideology and identity.
name any self-respecting people in the whole world who've acquiessed to support, en masse, a formerly oppressive, foreign ruling class?
would the irish prefer to be ruled by a priviledged class of english descendants? would the french want to be ruled by naturalised frenchmen of german extraction? what would happen in israel if german descendents were to somehow establish a powerful political lobby there and campaign for elections? would the nation not be reminded of the horrors of the holocaust pepertrated by their forebearers?
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True dat.
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!Sinudeity!
Mgaraji - And those that do blame apartheid are all highschool dropouts? Point in question, JZ.Report Abuse
MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhiristrategy is a plan of action designed to achieve a specific goal. strategy is all about gaining a position of advantage over adversaries or best exploiting emerging posibiliti
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You business school definition of the meaning of strategy, is not suitable for this argument first of all DA does not have advantage and socondly the are no posibilities emrging when the pupulation interms of race is against you!!!!!
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!Sinudeity!
The irony is, 75% of the DA's support base is black.Report Abuse
sh!tFaceSamsung
wil never happen in mi life to vote DA #white party# : over mi dead bodyReport Abuse
paracute
she is now feeling the heat of whites that are dominating her party that she filled their party with blacks and she knows well that they have nothing to do blacks. that's why she wants to build another party and that one definitely i will join, this lady has a style never mind her colour she has incredible and peaceful heart, don't be fooled by hatred and racism that you have. the thing is i hate all politicians so i will never affiliate to any political partyReport Abuse
Shredder
@DJ-Winneroldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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New National Party and Democratic Party which gave birth to DA were there so she had an alternative. If she wanted to vote for a black party, PAC was there (first elections). Another thing, if she had no alternative she could have stayed at home like what other blacks are doing.
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Mbeki_2
You know - after 4 elections people have realised that their vote really is SECRET. ANC has used scare tactics so people think their vote paper can be known. I think they go to rallies and get food, and tees BUT i think in 2013 they are going to vote secretly (NOT ANC) or else they just will NOT vote.Report Abuse
bytheway1
DJ-WinnerJesus, with these violent strikes I will also go to court to prevent them. Strike and mass actions should have it's rightful place in society, not this violence that we see.
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Tango
!Sinudeity!Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :
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ANC has never won WCape
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asaowe
Sinu plz give us stastistic from DA plzReport Abuse
DJ-Winner
Shredder@DJ-Winner
oldlady12
DJ Winner, you must be colourblind. Many white.s have voted ANC in the past ( I am one of them), and we are the loud ones now because we do not like being used like that.
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You did not have an alternative. It was before DA was established...
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New National Party and Democratic Party which gave birth to DA were there so she had an alternative. If she wanted to vote for a black party, PAC was there (first elections). Another thing, if she had no alternative she could have stayed at home like what other blacks are doing.
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Nobody took seriously parties from aparteid regime...
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Dzel
cornelius@Dzel - the DA is the main opposition, and the strongest by far. She surely has the right to state what she considers to be non negotiables. I am pretty sure that you won't be able find fault with thoses, and will also recognise that they are precisely what is lacking in the present government. Cast aside your sceptimism Dzel and join the future !
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No, she can suggest principles along which the party should be formed, not dictate. If it is about who has what support then why merge at all, why pretend to form a new party when what you want is a super-sized DA where the status quo remains and Zille calls the shot.
She does not want a new party, she just wants more votes. Zille is a bigot and a hypocrite that is why I just can't bring myself to like this woman. On the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE yet on the other she window dresses her leadership so she can get black votes; does the irony escape you?
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!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The DA is already winning. It took about 30 ANC wards in the past 2 years. It took a province from the ANC.I remember when the ANC held CT, their finances were in tatters, and everywhere you go, there is some @sshole driving around with a picture of JZ on his car door. Havent seen a JZ car-door in years.
Haters will hate, but the DA will take more and more voters every election.
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - "the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE"DA doesnt oppose AA/BEE. It opposes narrow-based AA/BEE.
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Dzel
By the way cornelous what is the future?Zille wants a South Africa where labour rights are curtailed and one can be fired at will and without second thought. That incident where a worker was dismissed for bringing food to a KFC outlet would have ended up with the employee having no recourse and his constitutional rights violated. Is this the future you are talking about?
The DA needs a new leader with fresh ideas to move forward, Zille is not the right person to lead the DA, definitely not the right person to lead this new party she is talking about.
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DJ-Winner
bytheway1DJ-Winner
Jesus, with these violent strikes I will also go to court to prevent them. Strike and mass actions should have it's rightful place in society, not this violence that we see.
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Nobody wants to see violence. Even Msholozi said it in the UN, but there is no need to go to court to stop people from protesting peacefully....
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!Sinudeity!
asaowe - Which statistics do you want? Got plenty of comparative stats on DA and ANC.Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
DJ-WinnerDA was the first white party that white people took seriously. All the other things nobody cares about...That is why I say white people did not have an alternative before DA...
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You are everything I said in my previous comment, what about the nnp and the DP? You must stop thumb sucking and look so stupid, there was many other parties as well, dude really, the sh1t you spew is really d.umb and there is d.umb people out there that might take your i.diotic comments as fact, training them also to be d.umbasses like you. STOP IT, make sure of your facts before you talk kak.
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DJ-Winner
!Sinudeity!DJ-Winner - The DA is already winning. It took about 30 ANC wards in the past 2 years. It took a province from the ANC.
I remember when the ANC held CT, their finances were in tatters, and everywhere you go, there is some @sshole driving around with a picture of JZ on his car door. Havent seen a JZ car-door in years.
Haters will hate, but the DA will take more and more voters every election.
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Zille wants to open a new party because DA can't win. Zille is admitting...
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - "the one hand she tells us about non-racialism and opposes AA and BEE"
DA doesnt oppose AA/BEE. It opposes narrow-based AA/BEE.
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Sin, we've been through this before I don't need to prove to you for the umpteenth time why race based AA and BEE is necessary and what the DA proposes is not genuine nor is it practical.
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, you are merely speaking from your hate for the DA. Your comments are not even factionally correct. Dont be a DJ-Winner here dude.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Yeah, we have discussed this PLENTY of times before. But every single time you revert back to the lie that the DA opposes BEE/AA.Whats up with that son?
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asaowe
!Sinudeity!The irony is, 75% of the DA's support base is black.
!Sinudeity!
asaowe - Which statistics do you want? Got plenty of comparative stats on DA and ANC.
About black making75% DA
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Shredder
@DJ-Winner - Nobody took seriously parties from aparteid regime...============================================
Even whites? Bearing Oldlady4 that she is white.
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bytheway1
DzelShe opposes bee, because in essence it is and proved to be unsuccessful. Secondly AA: This is damaging to the deeper sense of humanity and self actualization. Take JP in our national cricket team, he stepped out once because he said he wanted to play for the national team because he is the best, not because of his skin colour. And what did he and many other's prove, both on sport and other levels? IT'S TRUE. He and many others are there because they're 'flippen good!'
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Dude, you are merely speaking from your hate for the DA
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On the contrary, I think the DA is the only alternative to the ANC and would gladly vote for any party that can turn the tide of corruption, maladministration and other ills plaguing the ANC. The party however needs to also represent our collective interests and pursue these with direction and determination, it is a lack of appetite for the latter that turns me off.
The DA is pro-business much like Republicans are in the states, a party that is more concerned about business interests than it is about inequality, civil liberties and improving the lives of the people they represent is not the party for me.
Zille is an impediment to progress, one gets the feeling so ling as she is party president the DA will remain pro-business and will continue thinking window-dressing is the right way to win black votes; it isn't.
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Mndende
Zille you have my vote I am a registered Soweto voter with my whole family and relatives and my whole street except for two families who are on the ANC gravy train...the rest of us are DA!!!!! Asisayifuni i ANC but liberation movements don't live past 40 years, ours won't live past 30 years!!!! The ANC has expired probably Jesus is at the door!! Never say never! No one ever thought the ANC would rule don't write the DA off thina siyayivotela goeddddd....Report Abuse
Mndende
Lindiwe is huge and big and not a pretty face for sure but none of the ANC nincompoops come close to her smartness and eloquence and common sense!!!!That is a fact. The ANC thrives on rhetoric and populism and Lindiwe on facts. Lets give credit where its due..Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-business. How else do you want to create employment? The ANC is also pro-business."The DA is pro-business much like Republicans are in the states"
The democrats are also pro-business dude :P You do know that the democrats bailed out the automotive industry in the US, right?
No party in South Africa is like the republicans, you do realise this right?
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asaowe
I still repeat Ziller sees DA leadership swaying to Lindiwe's way and DA loosing white votes, all about power ppl. DA will be all black in 2020 leadership level.Report Abuse
Chichi7
The majority of blacks would rather have incompetent govt than allow whites to rule them. Truth is much as they hate corruption and all that is happening in the Govt right now, they hate the history attached to whites more.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Cheney who was on the board of Haliburton? He was a republican. What about the ANC, having board members on plenty of the mine companies. What about Hitachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the republican party right.
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Yeah, we have discussed this PLENTY of times before. But every single time you revert back to the lie that the DA opposes BEE/AA.
Whats up with that son?
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Don't call me son, I am not your friend.
I have asked you many times to explain to me how this will work in practice and you couldn't.
If you can't break this need based AA and BEE down and explain how it will work the shut the hell up. If you think you can put together a coherent argument this time around then the floor is yours. Convince me that the model as proposed by Zille will work particularly with apartheid and socio-economic circumstances we find ourselves in by race; I suggest you start by answering the question are we economically equal along racial lines?
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Cheney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on plenty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican party right.
Report Abuse
Tasto
She is aware if what we have been preaching to her little puppies blogging here that ANC currently might be messed up but DEvovledApartheid is no an laternative of the Black people it was and will never be!!@RobinH @Sinudity did u hear & yr crew?
Report Abuse
Mndende
Those 4 values are indeed essential to steer growth in SA. Those are facts! Lol now folks your ANC has white members and ministers if you claim that whi.tes never vote ANC what do you really mean? Are you that racist? What are those whi.te faces doing in parly I mean wh.ite ANC faces, the Ben Turoks, Hanekom,George Bizos...shame I pity any wh.te man who votes ANC...YOU are nothing but a used condom!!! The ANC is more racist than the DA! That is a fact!Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right.
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right.
Report Abuse
bytheway1
asaoweI will reiterate: Most white folks I know like Lindiwe. They do not care about colour, but efficiency.
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss."The DA is pro-busin3ss much like R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pro-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Of course the DA is pr0-busin3ss. How else do you want to cr3ate employm3nt? The ANC is also pr0-busin3ss."The DA is pr0-busin3ss much l1ke R3publicans are in the stat3s"
The d3mocrats are also pr0-busin3ss dude :P You do know that the d3mocrats ba1led out the @utomotive 1ndustry in the US, right?
What about D1ck Ch3ney who was on the bo@rd of Hal1burton? He was a r3publican. What about the ANC, having bo@rd m3mbers on pl3nty of the m1ne compani3s. What about H1tachi and the ANC. You do realise that the ANC is more like the r3publican p@rty right.
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Oops, sorry, Sowetan is broken, not me :PReport Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Every single time I explain to you how it will work in practise. Dont talk k@k buddy.You want evidence that the DA's model is working?
Lets look at national unemployment stats, shall we?
National unemployment: 25%
WCape unemployment: 18% (lowest in the country)
During the recession, South Africa bled 500,000 jobs. The WCape created 10,000 jobs.
$h17 son, the floor is yours.
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bytheway1
DzelShort term - cut of the weed... It grows again. Medium to long term - destroy the roots of the weed... problem solved. Education is the medium to long term answer... and how does our education system stand currently? IT'S A MESS!!!
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SOLUTIONS
TastoShe is aware if what we have been preaching to her little puppies blogging here that ANC currently might be messed up but DEvovledApartheid is no an laternative of the Black people it was and will never be!!
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Why would she want to bring back apartheid if she was one of the biggest anti-apartheid activities, I wish people would start to try and think before they spew sh1t here. just try, it will make your life much easier.
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Of course the DA is pro-busin3ss. How else do you want to create employm3nt? The ANC is also pro-busin3ss.
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Maybe I should explain this s.l.o.w.l.y. DA is a party that will see businesses get tax breaks, incentives and even be subsidised by tax funds i.e. the youth wage subsidy while the poor the poorer.
I don't subscribe to a mentality that says 2 jobs for the price of 1 with each getting half-a-salary is better than 1 job at full salary. Yes you may be creating 2 jobs but the two workers will be equally poor and will earn enough just to keep them going. That is apartheid mentality where workers had no rights, no recourse and were cheap resources to raise madam's kids.
DA's policy will take us back a few years as a nation, yes more may be employed but earning a slave wage and work under hellish conditions, how do I support that?
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!Sinudeity!
The DA will bring back apartheid.The DA is against BEE/AA
Ignorant people say the darndest things :P
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Every single time I explain to you how it will work in practise. Dont talk k@k buddy.
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Maybe in your head you make sense but in reality you don't. I've asked you to give it a shot if you think you can explain it so it makes sense and instead of doing that you tell me I am talking crap.
Don't waste my time if you can't respond to a simple request, I am in no mood to be disrespected by you.
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - EVERYONE supports the youth wage subsidy. The ANC, the DA, the BMF, SACP, BLA, SASCO, COSAS...Except, COSATU and Dzel :P
"DA's policy will take us back a few years as a nation, yes more may be employed but earning a slave wage and work under hellish conditions, how do I support that?"
Meanwhile, under the ANC's labour laws, 40 people died at a mine. The ANC has already taken us backwards son.
Report Abuse
Dzel
!Sinudeity!During the recession, South Africa bled 500,000 jobs. The WCape created 10,000 jobs.
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Which companies, which industries, what kind of jobs and what is the average wage?
What is your source?
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Not going to waste my time in explaining BEE/AA to you again for the 100th time. Nor am I going to bother pasting the policy PDF's and links again for you, for the 100th time.As for your arguments today, merely going to throw you into the same bucket as DJ-Winner. IE, $h17 talkers.
Report Abuse
Fred55
I would love a party to be formed with the following black leaders:Dr Mamphela Ramphele
Thuli Madonsela
Vusi Pikole
Trevor Manuel
Report Abuse
Tasto
@!Sinudeity! - Hey wena your madam is a major share holder at PicknPay with their slavery practices and casualisation of work.Can u imagine DevolvedApartheid even municipalities will be casualised !!Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
Tasto@Solutions – solution to what ? Another cracker Arrogant stupid white if u had solution from 1948 up to now this country wouldn’t have been in this mess it is.You grandfathers’s plan of Social-engineering has caught up with you and u whinging ppl why are u still here othas left and came back in droves we are not impress to say the least!!
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I am sorry, I was not here in 1948 you d.umb turd, I am here now and trying to build a better economy for my country, but with d.umbf*^ks like yourself it is difficult. I am not whining, I am stating the obvious facts that you are to s.tupid to see. Go look in the mirror and hate yourself more
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Fred55
The country is in a crisis and all the parties should ask Dr Mamphela Ramphele, Thuli MadonselaVusi Pikole,Trevor Manuel to govern on behalf of everyone in this country until we get out ourselves out of the crisis.
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Mndende
Siyaya ne DA phambili. The DA is showing growth what do you guys think? Do you think it is whyte folks? Pro business is good...pro equality is also good...but how do you make people equal unless you give out the best education system. Zimbabweans are more unequal now than ever before because equality cannot be tackled by man because we can all get R2 but one will decide to save it the other devour it the saver creates wealth the other not! If we continue to have more children than we can afford why should someone who has one child and is well educated be forced to be equal with someone who isnot? Being rich is no sin that is why my friend Mdletshe who is illiterate but managed to buy 41 taxis and started out as a taxi driver....anyone can be rich if they have the will.......to be....just create equal opportunities to resources and lets all fight and strive for equality. My brother is not equal to me. I have 4 kids he has one and he is enjoying life and wants no more kids....just an example!!Report Abuse
Fred55
Tasto, you are clearly a racist that can offer no reasonable solutions.Also, please provide proof that Helen Zille is a major shareholder in Pick n Pay.
Report Abuse
Dzel
bytheway1Dzel
Short term - cut of the weed... It grows again. Medium to long term - destroy the roots of the weed... problem solved. Education is the medium to long term answer... and how does our education system stand currently? IT'S A MESS!!!
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Education? You guys must think you can flash this education card and all arguments disappear.
Obviously education is a solution in the long run but please explain to me how is education an alternative to AA and BEE in the short to medium plan. How does it guarantee representative at all levels and uplift living conditions of black people in general in the short term?
Give me practical example, not theory please.
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Mndende
Fred you are right! I would also add Joel Netshitenze to those names there....Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
Fred55I would love a party to be formed with the following black leaders:
Dr Mamphela Ramphele
Thuli Madonsela
Vusi Pikole
Trevor Manuel
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I like your lineup, especially the top 2.
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Tasto
@Mndende - in your dreams !!Report Abuse
KeRataBasadi
So the crackers are giving up on governing, thats why they are retreating to the private sector and treating blacks like sh1t neh? Thats my opinion by the way.Report Abuse
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
As I said DA was the first white party that white people took seriously. All the other things nobody cares about...That is why I say white people did not have an alternative before DA... Those small parties you are talking about, nobody gave a fcuk about...
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Dude, you are a d.umb f*^k, a real turd who can't even think for himself, go and look at the facts you idiot, The NP was the 2nd biggest contender in 1994, then in 1999 it was the DP, then in 2000 the DP changed its name to the DA. F*^k if you do not even know this you should really not even speak politics you ugly piece of rotten placenta.
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Look between you legs, you will see a dumbie surounded by mayonaisse. L!ck some of that sh!t, you a$$hole...
I told you fool that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime...Are you drunk or what?
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Lehido
Im not happy with the ANC but What Hellen is saying will happen in her wrinkled dreamsReport Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - "your madam is a major share holder at PicknPay with their slavery practices and casualisation of work"LOL, no she's not.
The ANC on the meanwhile, shareholders in mine where people were shot, after they said they were getting paid minimal wage for dangerous work.
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!Sinudeity!
DJ-Winner - The ANC is a party from the apartheid regime.Report Abuse
Fred55
MndendeFred you are right! I would also add Joel Netshitenze to those names there....
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Well why don't we use this blogging platform to put a "dream" team together to govern this country?
I am happy with black leadership but the team must be the best, most honest and least corrupt people leaders in this country. They must have clean hands.
I would add Professor Jonathan Jansen to the list. He can head up the Education ministry and I would keep Dr Aaron Matsoaledi as minister of health.
Report Abuse
Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Not going to waste my time in explaining BEE/AA to you again for the 100th time. Nor am I going to bother pasting the policy PDF's and links again for you, for the 100th time.
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Thought as much, keep pretending you have made a point if it makes you feel good about yourself or you could do it again so that we don't waste time debating whether or not one was made in the past.
You can't even explain how one would define "need" on which the proposal is going to be based, all you can do is refer me to DA policy but I keep on telling you it does not explain anything. It is a document meant to make the DA look like they care when they don't, it is self-serving and thin on detail but if you think this amounts to an argument on your part then good for you. Unfortunately even if you did that you still would not have answered basic questions.
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, you keep saying that the DA is against BEE/AA, even though, they are in favour of BEE/AA.We are not even talking about the youth wage subsidy, which seems is what you are building your entire wobbly deck of cards on.
So, back to you, give me evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA.
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DJ-Winner
!Sinudeity!DJ-Winner - The ANC is a party from the apartheid regime.
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LOL....
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MorenaWaPolelo
NwanaPhiri!Sinudeity!
Do you know how jealous the ANC is of the DA winning the WCape? They are now even trying to reduce the provinces to win back the WCape :P
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Now that is strategy!!!!
Report Abuse
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
...
Look between you legs, you will see a dumbie surounded by mayonaisse. L!ck some of that sh!t, you a$$hole...
I told you fool that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime...Are you drunk or what?
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Sorry I do not have m.offie t.endencies, go and l.ick yours and see if it tastes the same as your mothers, placenta boy. Go and read my comment again slowly, I gave you the alternatives who was voted for.
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Your mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Your comment is fart....
Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - LOL, Im also a shareholder in PnP. Anyone can buy shares. That doesnt make hellen a 'major shareholder'.Report Abuse
FlyMachene747
Siya5297Dear Sis Dolly
I'm a 70 year old married man with 20 children and 6 wives...recently I had a child with my bestfriend's daughter...should I marry her?... from anonymous... eNkandla
_________________________________________________________________________________
Sis Dolly replies....:vo3tsek Zuma! I know its u.
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Haahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!! kwikwikwikwikwikwi tltltltltltltl....boom fatshe!!!! Eish! pleasee dont k1ll me man!!
Report Abuse
DrunkenMaster
I do not have a problem with ANC led government but i Have a problem with their fraud and corruption. Most of their so called leaders are not educated at all.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again.Report Abuse
MommaC
SA's complete political landscape needs a makeover. Everything from how we elect leaders to how the tiers of government interact. We have a shithouse load of politicians and nothing to show for it.Report Abuse
Winilen
Well Madam Zille for your information SA is still much divided between blacks & white... black people will never see eye to eye with white & ANC knows that very well & we should all axcept it...For a party like that to be formed it will need a black person as leader(not controlled by white like what the companies do bcos of BEE s&%$t) bcos majority of blacks still believe in ANC.
Report Abuse
Tasto
@!Sinudeity!MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again.
Hope Mangaung would come up with another resolution instead of reducing Bantusatans called "provinces" total dump this beurocracy !!
Secondly u claim that u r also a PnP share holder, u like Juju neh ? Will defend HZille even withg lies or U will kill for Zille ?
Report Abuse
Honeybadger
Hei zia buya mus la!Report Abuse
Dzel
!Sinudeity!So, back to you, give me evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA.
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You have not answered my question and you think you can turn around and put me on the spotlight, not a clever debating strategy Sin.
Anyway I'll oblige; do you understand what the objectives of AA and BEE are and why it is necessary to implement corrective measures long racial lines GIVEN THAT apartheid was a system meant to oppress and enslave along racial lines.
Do you understand that there is skewed distribution of labour by race from the lowest levels to executive and board levels. Do you understand there is still disparity by race in terms of income, living conditions, business opportunities etc by race. Do you understand there is direct correlation between race and the average property value by suburb.
If all indicators are that we are not equal and whites are at the top of the pile in every measure that counts then surely logic dictates that solutions must be formulated along racial lines. How does the principle of non-racialism uplift black people as a whole? How does it ensure we have better access to employment opportunities at a wage that is justifiable given the amount of effort required. What has the DA done to show their are genuine in the advancement of black people and I am not talking about poster-girl Mazibuko who advancement - if you call it that - was only done so they could fool blacks into voting DA?
How does a party that purports to advance my interests tell me, inspite of history and inspite of current trends regarding access to and distribution of wealth by race that sorry but the solution cannot be along racial lines. How do you explain that logic and is that a party that is genuinely committed to my advancement?
The problem with you Sin is you just say stuff without much thought process going on that is why you have somehow convinced yourself you make sense, think Sin please. Maybe if you thought more I would not have to explain the obvious man, use your brain for a change and stop being driven by your ego.
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bytheway1
DzelSo we agree on medium to long term. I do not know if you read one of my previous posts on bee / AA - that is my personal view. In practice AA jobs went to unqualified people, which created more problems than any solutions - it's wishful thinking. AA would not have been a problem if it was correctly implemented. Mayby AA worked for lower end jobs. As for BEE... phew? What can be said apart from bad implementation supporting tenderpreneurs benefiting a few. Instead of politicians ranting and raving about this and that, meaningful debates should concur on the issues that you and I are discussing, because sometimes we only ill-defy ourselves and maybe our theories overlap without us realizing it... I hope I have put this correctly.
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!Sinudeity!
Tasto - "Secondly u claim that u r also a PnP share holder"Yeah, got about R5,000 worth of shares in PnP. Bought it via PSGonline.co.za - Why dont you have any shares? Always complaining that 'minority control the economy', but refuse to buy shares himself :P
I will never k1ll for a politician. Just setting the record straight here. You just had to say 'major shareholder'. Which is not the truth unfortunately for you.
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SOLUTIONS
DJ-WinnerYour mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Your comment is fart....
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Your mother must have at least wife kids and fathered from different men and you want to call mine name. lololololol
google election results 1994 and you will get 1997 as well.
Go and search for them yourself, see if you can do it. See that you are wrong again.
Report Abuse
BlackSeed
You sound frustrated and lost now Helen. Are you getting pressured by the investors? Remember that investors want a political party that is in government for them to fulfill their corrupt desires. Are they threatening to pull out now since DA is going nowhere but fixed in the Cape for the few?Do that in the Cape and you’ll have support of the whole country. You don’t need to go into government in order for you to address issues in Cape Town.
Your marginal thinking can only afford you marginal support; that’s how it is.
Julius Malema will overtake you and become your boss one day; I wish to see your face then.
You need to start opposing the ANC through service delivery, not ganging up with other political parties to try and overthrow them; how do you think that will go down with some poor people in this country.
White ancestors caused this and unfortunately their siblings will suffer for eternity; just like some blacks do.
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SOLUTIONS
5 kids djwinner, not wife kids, that would not make her a WReport Abuse
Mzabalazo
Sep 28, 2012Shredder
@Afrojoy - What's needed in SA is a multir*cial but bl*ck driven opposition party, not born out of ANC-succession-politics-gone-wrong but born out of the need to fill up the leadership crisis we are facing in SA before our rainbow nation implodes and goes the Zim way.
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True. The ANC is mess up the country and keep on blaming apartheid for everything. Yes, apartheid has left a huge economic gap between blacks and whites. Having said that, the ANC is busy leaving out the well working structures that were developed by the apartheid government. SABC, SAA, etc. Schools that were built are now being closed. We can't afford more mess. We need a strong opposition party.
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You deserve a kiss, your comment is spot on
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Dude, I actually dont have to justify anything. YOU opened up with the statement that the DA is against BEE/AA. The onus is on you to back up your comment with some proof.Do you understand how debating works?
"Do you understand that there is skewed distribution of labour by race from the lowest levels to executive and board levels. Do you understand there is still disparity by race in terms of income, living conditions, business opportunities etc by race. Do you understand there is direct correlation between race and the average property value by suburb. "
And is this across South Africa (ANC provinces) or just in the WCape?
Come on dude, your arguments fail. You are like DJ, merely say the first thing that pops into your head, without any backing for it.
Report Abuse
MGEEZ
Zille for President!!!! She is the solution to the manifold problems that the Corruption party (ANC) has put our people through!!!Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Meanwhile, the SAIRR, did a skills audit, and found that the argument that people are placed in businesses by race to be invalid, and that placement indeed happens on education.And yet here you are, shooting down the importance of education.
Report Abuse
DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
Your mother is a whore_....I hear she broke your virginity...
Your comment is fart....
-----------------------------
Your mother must have at least wife kids and fathered from different men and you want to call mine name. lololololol
google election results 1994 and you will get 1997 as well.
Go and search for them yourself, see if you can do it. See that you are wrong again.
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Yours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
Report Abuse
Dzel
bytheway1So we agree on medium to long term. I do not know if you read one of my previous posts on bee / AA - that is my personal view. In practice AA jobs went to unqualified people, which created more problems than any solutions
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You are looking at AA from an incorrect position. Let's take spot for example.
What quotas did was force coaches to field players of colour, obviously since winning is the ultimate prize these players were given the necessary support, given the opportunity and training to make them successful so they got better and better. In Rugby we had Chester Williams in '95 but later we had the likes of Breyton Paulse, Ashwin Willemse (sp?) etc and now the likes of Mvovo, Ndingane twins, Elton Janties, etc. In cricket we now have a Philander who is up there with the best. Amla is probably the best batsman we have produced post 1994 if not ever.
The point is because we gave these guys opportunities and made sure they have all they need to succeed and now they are important members of both rugby and cricket teams. We have a bigger pool of players to choose from and as a result our squads are better. The alternative would have been keeping both sports as white preserves and we would not have had these wonderful players.
Similarly with AA what you need is someone with the rights qualifications, right attitude and right drive. With the necessary support and training these individuals will become better and will contribute meaningfully in the success of the company. You speak of these individuals as unqualified but I have a long list of impediments AA candidates face including regressive attitudes like yours that assumes because one is black then they are less qualified and less capable; what do you base this statement on exactly?
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SOLUTIONS
BlackSeedYou sound frustrated and lost now Helen. Are you getting pressured by the investors? Remember that investors want a political party that is in government for them to fulfill their corrupt desires. Are they threatening to pull out now since DA is going nowhere but fixed in the Cape for the few?
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Which investors are you talking about, also why did the DA take another 2 wards in black areas just last week, kaya and another one if they only cater for a few?
Do that in the Cape and you’ll have support of the whole country. You don’t need to go into government in order for you to address issues in Cape Town.
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What issues, Cape Town is the bes run city in Africa.
Your marginal thinking can only afford you marginal support; that’s how it is.
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The problem is marginal thinkers is in the majority at the moment and is voting for the corrupt, with every election and every bi election the DA is winning support because the marginal thinkers eyes are opening and starting to think outside the box and not marginally anymore.
Julius Malema will overtake you and become your boss one day; I wish to see your face then.
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HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAAHHA, he has already overtaken her with about 200kg's
You need to start opposing the ANC through service delivery, not ganging up with other political parties to try and overthrow them; how do you think that will go down with some poor people in this country.
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Go and see how many RDP houses and basic services the DA provided against the anc in the same time frame, if DA did not do this why were they not voted out with the last election but received more votes. (logic)
White ancestors caused this and unfortunately their siblings will suffer for eternity; just like some blacks do.
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I am not suffering, I am working my ass off, I work from 07h00 until 21h00 at night, but it is worth it. No need to suffer for anyone.
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SOLUTIONS
DJ-WinnerYours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
--------------------------------
I see the truth hurts, how many bro's and ho's do you have from different fathers, do you even know yours.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
I ask you please to check it out, you will see you were wrong again,
Here is one for you ,
http://electionresources.org/za/provinces.php?election=1994
OOOOOPPPPPPSSS djloser is wrong again./
Report Abuse
Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - Meanwhile, the SAIRR, did a skills audit, and found that the argument that people are placed in businesses by race to be invalid, and that placement indeed happens on education.
And yet here you are, shooting down the importance of education.
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Comprehension skills are important Sin. I never said education is not important, I said let us not front it as an alternative to AA in the shot-term; I hope this is not too complicated a statement for you to process.
You can either start answering questions so we can have a constructive debate or you can keep on ducking and diving and making stupid comments that do not take us forward. The choice is yours but I am not going to let your ego get in the way of the debate around what needs to be done to uplift black people in general and why some parties cannot front themselves as agents of that change.
If you don't have anything of substance to add I beg you to stop with your pointless one-liners, it is obvious there is noting constructive that one should expect from you Sin; it is all about you and you having the last word when you've said absolutely nothing worth taking note of.
Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
TastoSouth African Black children in WC are called refugees in their own country by a European!!Sowetan Ediotor\webateam want us to say One S.ettler One Bouguet-o-Flower instead of One S.ettler One B….
HZille go to hell !!
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Don't change her words, she said educational refugees and she did not use any word of colour, there is a difference.
Why did you not make a big stink when one of your anc cadres called black people migrants?
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!Sinudeity!
Tasto - The folks in the ECape who moved here because of deteriorating conditions in the ECape are refugees.You should be raging at the ECape government, not at the WCape about this issue.
The ECape government now has to fire 11,000 teachers, because it cant afford them. Were expecting a bigger influx of refugees from the ECape in preperation for the next schoolyear.
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cornelius
@DZEL the future is a stable, well run country, creating wealth through a market system that is essentially free, but with sufficient regularisation and social policies to prevent rampant capitalism and to ensure a sufficient safety net even for the poor, unemployed and uneducated. The key to a winning nation is education - for this a lot of money is needed to properly equip and staff especially the schools in the previously disadvantaged areas - Sadtu will have to be reigned in so that teachers can stop thinking of themselves as workers, but as committed professionals in a noble profession. putting the education of our children above everything else. We HAVE to get rid of the scum teachers who are failing our children with their strikes at important times, drunkennes, sexual conduct, etc, this is crucial. The rich schools must take a back seat while the schools in the townships are brought to world class standard. Affrimative action policies must be maintained, but implemented effectively and fairly, by a government that will not allow itself to fall into the trap of cronyism, and not create an absolute bar to employment of w.hites, discouraging youth in the minority groups, such as Woolworths did recently - that is unconstitutional and a violation of the EE Act by the way. Our constitution provides a briliant frasmework for the society we should be - it must be our bible.In ten years, we can achieve the dream of nonracialism, where the colour of a persons skin will not count ( Martin Luther King, Bob Marley, Nelson Mandela ) and then we can become one of the strongest nations in the world, taking Africa with us.
I can go on, but have to go now.
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DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
Yours sells her vagina_ for a living. She fucks_ atleast 10 guys per day.
--------------------------------
I see the truth hurts, how many bro's and ho's do you have from different fathers, do you even know yours.
Your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
I ask you please to check it out, you will see you were wrong again,
Here is one for you ,
http://electionresources.org/za/provinces.php?election=1994
OOOOOPPPPPPSSS djloser is wrong again./
.................................................................................................
You are a product of prostitution and you know it.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - You are the one evading the questions dude. You said that the DA is against BEE/AA.I'll ask you again (Please answer the damned question, stop evading it)...
What proof do you have?
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Shredder
@Mzabalazo - You deserve a kiss, your comment is spot on===========================================
Mcwaah! :-D
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DA-DBN-GUY
DJ-WinnerYou are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc.
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bytheway1
DzelOn sport level, I agree with your comment... but they are there purely because they deserve it, not because of quotas. On AA: I surely do not assume that blacks are less qualified.... I should be a fair game - employ the best candidate, irrespective of skin colour. The thing is, especially looking at local government, is your scenario reflective, or is it nepotism? Look, I do not have formal figures based on studies, but there were some situations in my area where very qualified whites lost against much lesser qualified blacks. And, this educational mess is surely not doing much for equalizing the employment situation. I take your comment to heart, but we also need to look at the situation holistically.
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Dzel
!Sinudeity!Dzel - You are the one evading the questions dude. You said that the DA is against BEE/AA.
I'll ask you again (Please answer the damned question, stop evading it)...
What proof do you have?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You mean after that lengthy explanation you still don't get it, I am afraid I don't have a Panado for what it is you are suffering from man. You are on your own on this one, those brain cells must have stopped working a long time ago.
Enough of this, stop wasting my time Sin.
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SOLUTIONS
DJ-WinnerYou are a product of prostitution and you know it.
-----
and you of rape.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
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you are a f__king idiot, I just gave you the proof. Look at the numbers on that page, some whites voted anc, the majority did not, unless there were 10 million whites in SA which there was not.
Lets stop, go and search for your father, maybe he can give you some brains, you need it.
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Dzel
bytheway1Dzel
On sport level, I agree with your comment... but they are there purely because they deserve it, not because of quotas. On AA: I surely do not assume that blacks are less qualified.... I should be a fair game - employ the best candidate, irrespective of skin colour.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
How old are you?
Do you even understand why AA is necessary?
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Printa
Very intelligent move Mam 'uzille. Its an idea really that will liberate all SAfricansReport Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Dzel - ROFLOL, you havent explained ANYTHING son. You tried to tell me the definition of BEE/AA, and why it is needed. You havent provided ANY evidence that the DA is against BEE/AA. You used the youth wage subsidy to liken them to the republicans.That is all, you havent provided ANY PROOF.
We can all assume from your reluctance to provide facts here, that the DA is indeed in favour of BEE/AA.
Thanks son. Your inability to debate is staggering./
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DA-DBN-GUY
!Sinudeity!Dzel - You are the one evading the questions dude. You said that the DA is against BEE/AA.
I'll ask you again (Please answer the damned question, stop evading it)...
What proof do you have?
You are wasting your time with this one dude. i have tried to get answers from DZEL before to no avail. he uses long sentences but has yet to fully answer ANY question posed and the throws in the usual "Enough of this, stop wasting my time" as he cannot back up any of his statements.
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYDJ-Winner
You are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc.
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How was the DA formed kind sir?
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!Sinudeity!
DA-DBN-GUY - Clearly...He reminds me of Cartman from South park. When he starts to lose an argument, the only thing you get in response is "Scr3w you guys, Im going home"
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelNot from the NP!!
The Democratic Alliance (DA) is a South African political party, the governing party in the Western Cape province, and the official opposition to the ruling African National Congress (ANC). The party traces its roots to the anti-apartheid movement of the 1970s and 1980s, during which time it was known variously as the Progressive Party, the Progressive Reform Party, and the Progressive Federal Party.
Does this help in any way?
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - Lets have a look at what wikipedia says:"During the 1990s the party was known as the Democratic Party, but was renamed to the Democratic Alliance, during a short-lived alliance with the New National Party (NNP) in 2000 - the NNP subsequently left to join the ANC."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Alliance_%28South_Africa%29
So, the NNP left the DA to join the ANC.
So... the ANC is an apartheid party?
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DJ-Winner
SOLUTIONSDJ-Winner
You are a product of prostitution and you know it.
-----
and you of rape.
As I said your google will not change the fact that people did not want to vote for a party from aparteid regime. Hence, they opted for ANC as they did not have a choice...
------------------
you are a f__king idiot, I just gave you the proof. Look at the numbers on that page, some whites voted anc, the majority did not, unless there were 10 million whites in SA which there was not.
Lets stop, go and search for your father, maybe he can give you some brains, you need it.
...............................................
I told you where idiot is. Did you l!ck that sh!t yet or you are saving it for dinner?
Your stupid stats have failed to support your comment. How about shoving that stats in your stinking a$$hole?
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imfene
I had no idea this lady was so popular. Maybe Julius and Helen?Report Abuse
MAPENDANA
Morning Guys :well i think rlly Hellen is having a point ,but for her and his family and frends to do it for deir needs coz dey all hungry lions, not dat dey think abt how we S>A feels, and dey fool us why dey jst don clean da mess instead of continuing to have more partys wat dat mean ... well i think hellen fools us how many parties we have sam are olready dead by now but when kufiki xesha loku khankasa all parties jst wake up from deir graves ,,,,
4 me ill rada vote for NFP. why not we change guys and let us have a black women leader what you think guys jst asking ?
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!Sinudeity!
According to history, it seems that the NP is more comfortable with the ANC, than it was with the DA.Interesting.
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bytheway1
DzelOK, if it's necessary why is the employment field still so unequal? What went wrong in 18 years?
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Pitso.MCCMA.SAFA
No one can believe a fakeReport Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYDzel
Not from the NP!!
The Democratic Alliance (DA) is a South African political party, the governing party in the Western Cape province, and the official opposition to the ruling African National Congress (ANC). The party traces its roots to the anti-apartheid movement of the 1970s and 1980s, during which time it was known variously as the Progressive Party, the Progressive Reform Party, and the Progressive Federal Party.
Does this help in any way?
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You know the problem is I am debating against ignorance.
Guys look up how the then DP merged with the NP, research how and why floor-crossing legislation was introduced, look at how the NP leadership left the alliance after they were made the junior partner in the alliance.
If you knew what you were talking about we would not need to debate obvious points then you top it all off by providing links.
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Cl!ck-
Vote AZAPO..Report Abuse
SOLUTIONS
DJ-WinnerI told you where idiot is. Did you l!ck that sh!t yet or you are saving it for dinner?
Your stupid stats have failed to support your comment. How about shoving that stats in your stinking a$$hole?
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No I left it for you mom to clean up, she is busy cleaning the house.
I am actually sitting here with my hands between my head in amazement of how s.tupid you are. I gave you proof that your comment was wrong, not mine. Dude you should really catch a wakeup.
Let me give you some advise:
Put your finger as far as possible into your nose and put the cockroach back onto its little wheel, this will help your thinking.
Stop snorting so hard, actually use tissues to blow your nose, this will keep the cockroach from falling off.
Stop spitting, the movement makes the little cockroach fall off.
Try the above steps and you might start to think a little with the help of the cockroach. Never forget your little buddy, he sometimes fall off and need your help. All people without brains were given one of these.
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Dzel
bytheway1OK, if it's necessary why is the employment field still so unequal? What went wrong in 18 years?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Many reasons; a lack of appetite, a lack of commitment, a lack of necessary support, etc.
By the way AA has not failed as you put it, if you understand structural objective it meant to address we have made serious strides, opened doors, etc but it is not enough. We need to grow the black middle class even more, make sure more people have access to opportunities and ironically this will address the question of education albeit indirectly.
We cannot stop AA now and simplistic reason like 18 years after democracy is not the solution as it misses the point completely.
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!Sinudeity!
Dzel - "look at how the NP leadership left the alliance after they were made the junior partner in the alliance."Err... no. Thats not why the NNP left the DA and joined up with the ANC. They did it to try and change their image as a racially-aligned apartheid party.
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BlackSeed
SOLUTIONSIt means they are doing something right in that ward, simple as that.
You read too much newspaper. If DA cannot make sure that the ANC delivers in the Cape, how will they ensure service delivery in the whole country? Irrelevant of whether ANC runs those wards or not, DA need to show that they can defeat poverty incomparably.
That’s not the ANCs problem. DA should win votes easily if they are better than ANC.
Where and how many RDPs? Do they live in the RDP houses?
You work too much. Is that greed for money? Don’t you think they should hire someone to relieve you so you can go home and rest; tomorrow is another day. Yet you expect the ANC to create jobs when the likes of you work for more than 8hrs, for what? Give others a chance
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelDA-DBN-GUY
DJ-Winner
You are such an ijit and brain dead. DA was NEVER a party from apartheid regime. Get that into that block head of yours already. The NP was the ruling party then and they joined with the anc.
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How was the DA formed kind sir?
OH FFS!! You really are a daft one indeed. the question YOU ASKED was answered. The DA was formed long before the floor crossing and shor alliance with the NNP just under a different name. You wouldnt know a fact if it hit you square in the face. You dont debate at all you supply your opinion without providing fact. thats not debating.
Floor crossing occured in all the political parties and in fact that is how the anc managed to win some wards. Legislation was introduced after the anc wooed members from other parties after that party won a seat and then it went to the anc after floor crossing. The MF did it with the anc and so did the NFP and we all know that the NNP jumped into bed to secure certain ministers posts.
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mkabayi
it's only by supporting a pan-africanist party, whose objective is the creation of a single, unitary african nation from cape to cairo, from morocco to madagascar that we africans can achieve genuine liberation and self-determination. the 'white core' from whose loins the DA comes and who are its chief 'brain' and sponsor are all too happy with the global status quo in which the west continues to dictate how people should live instead of minding their own business. the foreign european oppressor cannot see anything wrong with their kith and kin in the west who, after all, guarantee their very survival in africa.
the 'bigger picture' is directly relevant to our current problems. the reason why SA is undergoing de-industrialisation (and massive, INCREASING unemployment) to the extent that a simple t-shirt cant be profitably manufactured here and we soon would be importing basic food stuffs from 'lowest producer' countries through Walmart is because, on its own SA - and all african countries- are too weak to influence the rapacious greed coming with globalisation and the dictatorship of the market.
how will the DA, reduce inequality in SA (mainly race-based)and simultaneously create high-quality, sustainable employment for the majority? it can't. only within an economically and militarily strong, united africa can we decide on our own, which economic system best suites our 1 billion people. in terms of natural resources african is by far the wealthiest continent on earth.
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Maader
(South Africa's rand weakened against the dollar after Moody's cut the government's bond rating by one notch to Baa1 from A3.The ratings agency cited worries about the government's institutional strength and South Africa's investment climate and political stability. The credit outlook remains negative.)
So, I ask, what is this government doing for us South Africans. Whether you are black, white, indian, coloured, asian.. whatever.. You are screwed.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DZELAA is not working bcos it only benefits those aligned with the leaders of the anc. AA was intended to advance the blacks due to reverse the effect apartheid had on blacks in the workplace. But we have a situation where blacks are put into positions merely bcos they are black and NOT neccessarily qualified for the position. Educating the youth adequately is more important than simply putting a person of color into a position just bcos they are a person of color. 18 years of democracy has dumbed down the education to a level where degrees are not worth they paper they are printed on, are easily forged and falsified.
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bytheway1
I surely believe that a growing black middle class will uplift our economy by strides, but just how does that have to do with a failed education system? On AA: My definition is - when equally qualified black and white apply for a job, the black person will get preference. My problem is that (maybe not always, but many times) a lessor qualified black gets the job... Just another question, for how long should AA be continued... taken that sometimes lack of drive etc. is reality. By the way, many white young folks also has lack of drive and ambition.Report Abuse
ThirdEye
Finally, she came to her senses.Report Abuse
Tasto
From PFP DP DA whateva they can evolve up to gates of HELL, these whites must just fcuk-off with DevolvedApartheid even under a new disguise!!See them fighting for power !
But they know not the hour!
So they bribing with their guns, spare-parts and money!
Trying to belittle our Integrity now!!
They say what we know
Is just what they teach us!
And we're so ignorant!
'Cause every time they can reach us!
Through political strategy (Darnest damn new Political party?)
They keep us hungry (cheap labour @PnP Anglo American mines)!
And when you gonna get some food(AA BEE)!
Your brother got to be your enemy !
P.S Comrades these are lyrics by BMarley – “Ambush in the Night” . they can run around at nite having secret meeting to form new party to fight Balcks&anc but we know them!!
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WarrenG
Helen Zille and Patricia de Lille starts the new party!mazibuko takes the reigns of the DA and in 8 years they form an alliance.
Bang, you've got more of the population challenge the ANC. Easy.
Do properly what COPE fukked up. A valid solid party. No bullsh!te like the joke of COPE
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SOLUTIONS
SOLUTIONSIt means they are doing something right in that ward, simple as that.
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You lost me on this one, so the anc is doing something right in that ward and that is why the people is now voting DA?
You read too much newspaper. If DA cannot make sure that the ANC delivers in the Cape, how will they ensure service delivery in the whole country? Irrelevant of whether ANC runs those wards or not, DA need to show that they can defeat poverty incomparably.
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It is not really the DA's work to make sure the anc must give service delivery, is that how you anc guys see it, if no one is looking I do not have to do my job. The DA created the most jobs in that province through making it the best run city in Africa, people want to invest and tourism is on the rise, tourism is one of your main incomes.
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That’s not the ANCs problem. DA should win votes easily if they are better than ANC.
Where and how many RDPs? Do they live in the RDP houses?
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Go and google for RDP houses build between the years that the anc was there and then go and check while the DA is there in the same amount of years. The DA is winning votes because people see they are the better party, it is just people who idiotically think that the DA want to bring back Apartheid that do not want to vote for them, fat boy malema is also one who spews this nonsense to his marginally thinking supporters.
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You work too much. Is that greed for money?
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No, I want to employ more people and support more schools, currently involved with a feeding program that feeds more than 1000 kids at school everyday for lunch. Money is a nice thing to have, it only makes your live easier, when you reached a point where you can pay yourself a salary that makes that you enjoy your surrounds it is time to give back.
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Don’t you think they should hire someone to relieve you so you can go home and rest; tomorrow is another day. Yet you expect the ANC to create jobs when the likes of you work for more than 8hrs, for what? Give others a chance
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LOL, I think you got it in the previous part of my comment, you really have no idea. Shame,
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!MorenaWaPolelo - The people of WCape will reject that strategy. And if push comes to shove, than WCape will split off from South Africa (like N and S Sudan), to prevent the province from being governed by the ANC again
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How will they split from SA like N and S Sudan? Do honestly belive that can happen in a democratic country?
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ILLUMINATED
@Dzel, SinThat AA and Gender Equity shenanigans cost some of us big time. I still say people should be appointed based on merit and not colour or gender.
@Mapendana
Don't start with your feminist tendencies, it's not about gender or colour, get it into your head. It's about having the right credentials.
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DA-DBN-GUY
bytheway1Well said. I think education is more important than AA. Just take a look at varsity entrance requirements and you will see that black students have a far lower entrance prerequisite than all the other races. Not only that places are reserved for black students only regardless of their grades. I heard on the radio from the University of Natal medical school that if they take 100 first year students 89 HAVE to be black. This is both unconstitutional as well as racist and it also eliminates students entering who are more deserving based on grades.
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DA-DBN-GUY
TastoGet a fukken clue you racist git!! The DA fought against apartheid and the NP. Keep voting for your Another National Cockup and see what tune you will be singing in the near future,
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!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - Of course, all you would need is to have a referendum in the WCape, and if the majority vote in favour of the split, then WCape will be the newest country in the world.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Tasto - Isnt it ironic that you are singing Bob Marley songs about 'oppresive governments', even though you are governed by the ANC?Through political strategy (Blaming apartheid, and using anti-white hate)
They keep us hungry (Lonmin mines, ANC board members, fuel prices, electricity prices (Hitachi))
And when you gonna get some food (Your fat politicians aint lookin hungry)
Your brother got to be your enemy (Your fellow South African)
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!Of course, all you would need is to have a referendum in the WCape, and if the majority vote in favour of the split
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The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums, because of the racial canotations it has, so that will not happen. Also Wcape is bot seperate from any province it falls withun the confines of the SA constitution. The ruling party can rule on reducing the province if that is observed by the constitution.
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!Sinudeity!
ILLUMINATED - "That AA and Gender Equity shenanigans cost some of us big time. I still say people should be appointed based on merit and not colour or gender."Of course, people should be appointed on merit and not colour. But lets have a look at the state of education in the country. If we had to implement people based on education, then all companies would be 90% white. So of course, the poor excuse of colour is brought in again.
Meanwhile, we have incompetent directors running state parastatals. We have playwrights running youth agencies. We have cleaning ladies posing as MP of the military. We have dudes with BA degrees running the higher institutions of South Africa. We have a president who didnt even pass highschool.
And these deployees are costing us billions. Denel, Eskom, Transet, SAA all required bailouts. The board of SAA just resigned?
Welcome to BEE/AA, ANC style.
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Honeybadger
Hebanna this idiots are still at it!Report Abuse
bytheway1
DA-DBN-GUYWe are not even speaking of the gap between grade 12 and 1st year students. This is reality regardless race! I also agree with you on 'reservation for blacks', since one of my friends were turned down due to this, even though he had excellent grades. Again, I reiterate, let the deserving ones get it, then maybe the lessor deserving ones will be working harder to deserve.
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DA-DBN-GUY
bytheway1100% behind you on that dude!
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Cl!ck-
@ HoneybadgerStop making onions cry.. Or are you that ugly??
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!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - "The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums"Yeah it does. What racial problem does the constitution have with referendums?
According to the constitution chapter 14, section 235, the Cape is entitled to statehood if it so chooses. Article 1 of the United Nations Charter and various UN general assembly resolutions dealing with sovereignty and independence.
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Tasto
@MorenaWaPolelo - don't entertain Volkstaat in any guise DA is ebd of racist rightwingers that fact that is why Zille want a clean slate!!Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
Tango - My real name is "Jou ma" and my surname is a word sowetan blocks :PReport Abuse
Tasto
ANC at Mangaung must cleanse itself new leadershipResolve to do away with provinces
Speed up up genuine transformation for 18 years tried to push reconciliation and got what at the end ARROGANT racist whites, they can emmigrate who cares they been singing the same song since 1994 who can blame them THEY still play Elvis Presely songs in this age as if its an in fashion!!
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KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
The DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.==========
Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down.
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MorenaWaPolelo
!Sinudeity!MorenaWaPolelo - "The constitution of this country does not entertain referendums"
Yeah it does. What racial problem does the constitution have with referendums?
According to the constitution chapter 14, section 235, the Cape is entitled to statehood if it so chooses. Article 1 of the United Nations Charter and various UN general assembly resolutions dealing with sovereignty and independence
================================
That normaly happens in countries that are not governable so your Wcape does not qualify!!!
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Tango
!Sinudeity!.....easy JackReport Abuse
MAPENDANA
ha ha ha ha ha ha guys am so in lav with dis debate but to cam to an end of it ,,,,, what is da best solution for all of dis,,,,,according to my little knowl,,,,,, nometa wat we do or try our country is not going to change for wat it is ,,,, we will die instead complaining, wishing, for nothingevery1 nid to fyt for him/her self rada dan cracking your mynds abt apartheid,,, and wat i know poverty is not going to end either we lyk it or not,,,,,
and even if we rule by a men or women,either white,black or blue,,, he/ she neva eva change dis country,,,,can one of you guys tell me how many human beings in dis country and you guys still having more babies and you think our govament is going to handly dis situation hell no in our dreams ,,,,,, our country is not going to change for wat it is
either we vote for a billionare or zillionare,millionare even imikhukhu will neva eva iphele so stop cracking your mynds with ................... or else you are bored guys even hellen can have anada party dat will make no diff,,, even me i can have my own party wat you think guys LOLMENTTTTTTTTTT
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Hail
Hey, enough now. How about we open our own political party? mmmmmmmmh? We know what we want for this country so stop blahbaring and let see if u have what it takes. Only those who want progress not those who want to dwell in the past. Those who will let the past to be history and make their own by puting this country on the map for the good reason. Anyone interested? @ !Sinudeity! do not worry people are more wiser now, we have past the black and white hatred but we are here to see the rainbow nation growing for better. Zille for President!Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepeThe DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.
==========
Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down.
Crooks where exactly dude? They not incompetent but realise coalitions are neede to get rid of the anc due to their blind followers. Incompetence has 3 letters A N C!! Malema is only popular in the press. They said 15000 would hold avigil for Juju before his court appearance and yet 2000 showed up, mostly school chilrend that were bused in to falsify his true support.
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!Sinudeity!
MorenaWaPolelo - Nah, its not about governance, in the SA constitution its based self-determination of any community sharing a common cultural and language heritage.Report Abuse
!Sinudeity!
DA-DBN-GUY - It was more like 600 people that pitched.Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
!Sinudeity!DA-DBN-GUY - It was more like 600 people that pitched
Even better, just quoting an article I read.
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madimetsha
Zille has seen a gap in SA politics, we do really need an alternative to ANC and DA, poeple vote for ANC as loyalty for liberating the country, people vote for DA becuase it gave them what they have, people vote for COPE becuase they are angry with ANC, people vote for APC becuase they madwith IFP, so we basically vote based on history,which is emotions as we feel some sense of loyalty or anger, hence closer to voting times we get reminded how apartheid was, and a few promises about the future, which never materialise , we need political parties which will be be about now and the future. where we will change the landscape of politics as opposed to the traitional political system.Report Abuse
Tasto
Comrades go to yr community structures amataverns stokvels funerals raise the issue of provinces\bantustans.ANC must remove them Zille would be reduces to an ordinary howler in Parliament just tha!!Report Abuse
xBusi
@TastoThere might be "white racists bloggers" like you call them, but that does not detract from the fact that you are a black racist blogger. Stop focusing on colour the whole time and focus on the issues at hand. The issue is that Zille thinks a new party could challenge the ANC... It has nothing to do with race, but rather about policy and delivery!
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KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUYKatakataEmaotoAditshepe
The DA, which runs the Western Cape and the City of Cape Town, has been wooing smaller opposition parties to join it in its fight to reduce ANC dominance.
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Lol.Listen to these crooks,but anyaway they accepted that they're incompetent.If Malema could open his party that's the only party will bring ANC down.
Crooks where exactly dude? They not incompetent but realise coalitions are neede to get rid of the anc due to their blind followers. Incompetence has 3 letters A N C!! Malema is only popular in the press. They said 15000 would hold avigil for Juju before his court appearance and yet 2000 showed up, mostly school chilrend that were bused in to falsify his true support.
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Why dont they implement such coalitions in DA to better their political stand than suggesting formation of new part that will tackel ANC out of power?
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DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepeHow do the DA for a coalition with themselves? A coalition is between other parties is it not? A new party may be seen as being a non white only party as the DA is being made out to be now.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DA-DBN-GUYKatakataEmaotoAditshepe
When this party comes about you will see some anc "constituitionalists" joining and there increasing their credibility. Dr Mamphele, hope I spelt it right, or even Thabo Mbheki's brother would be the ideal candidate to lead the new Party
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KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUYKatakataEmaotoAditshepe
How do the DA for a coalition with themselves? A coalition is between other parties is it not? A new party may be seen as being a non white only party as the DA is being made out to be now.
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Okay! in that one they'll have to come and join ANC(black community party) to make the needed coalition they are talking about.
What do you think,that will bring new minds that Helen wishes to see?
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FarCeSpotter
I think no politician should be in charge of delivery. The skills required to be a politician and the skill required to organise and ensure delivery is fundamentally different.As long as we are hoping for any political party to "rescue" us, we will sit idle and dream.
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DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepeHellen obviously wants those within the anc that uphold the constitution and not the powermongers that crave power. the latter are the ones that spread racist rhetoric and the ghost of apartheid at every turn. We cant move forward if we are always looking back and are ruled by corrupt leaders
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xBusi
@TastoI am not supporting any party here. I am commenting on the fact that you point fingers but in many ways you are what you seem to hate.
The fact that a rudderless party rules SA and continues to do so, says something about the intelligence of the voters though!
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KatakataEmaotoAditshepe
@DA-DBN-GUYKatakataEmaotoAditshepe
Hellen obviously wants those within the anc that uphold the constitution and not the powermongers that crave power. the latter are the ones that spread racist rhetoric and the ghost of apartheid at every turn. We cant move forward if we are always looking back and are ruled by corrupt leaders.
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She must go and get them.lol
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DA-DBN-GUY
KatakataEmaotoAditshepeAs soon as they are offered an alternative they will come
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madimetsha
kReport Abuse
Tango
In 2014 the will FYL and NFP which can both overtake DA as the oppositionReport Abuse
Respect10
Zille said the historical roots of the current political parties were making it difficult for them to challenge the dominant position of the ANC alone.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1st reason that will make it hard for DA to take over ANC
2. DA is always complaining about ANC thinking that most of us do not understand politics, ppl do not really want to hear about complains but what are you going to do for them, ( Obama won the USA elections on telling people what they wanted to hear, something they wanted, change and he never saw race as an obstacle to his dream and the dream of thse ppl. he was not much into complaining of all the things that the rulling party was doing.
3. The other problem with DA is that they want to win black votes and I blv any party that goes with that strategy won't succeed,
4 I usually tell people is not about the RACE but how you sell your product to ppl (ANC has the thing that whites won't vote for a black party and white blv blacks wont vote for a white party, sell ur ideas and c, Obama sold his ideas and were bought by every1 black n whites)
5 DA was formed as a come back political party
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DA-DBN-GUY
TangoIn 2014 the will FYL and NFP which can both overtake DA as the opposition
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Neither will exist by then!
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYHow was the DA formed kind sir?
OH FFS!! You really are a daft one indeed. the question YOU ASKED was answered. The DA was formed long before the floor crossing and shor alliance with the NNP just under a different name. You wouldnt know a fact if it hit you square in the face. You dont debate at all you supply your opinion without providing fact. thats not debating.
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See this is what I hate debating against, completely clueless yet indignant in your ignorance.
Floor-crossing was requested formally by the then DP and NP so they could form an alliance that is now known as DA. The ANC acceded to that request, the constitution was amended accordingly and floor crossing became a reality in 2003 and all 8 seats then held by the NP moved over to the DP or DA as it became known.
Want proof:
History
Floor crossing legislation was initially requested by the Democratic Partyand the New National Party in November 2001, as a means of formalising their unification into the Democratic Alliance. The African National Congress, which held the power in the legislature to change the constitution, did not favour the measure at the time, as they perceived the DA initiative to be a "congealing of a race and class based political opposition".[9] However, when the NNP leadership announced their desire to leave the DA and form alliances with the ANC in 2001, the ANC passed the legislation. ANC chairman Mosiuoa Lekota stated that the party's reasons for the legislation was "for some political realignment…and the break-up of racial power blocks".[9]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floor_crossing_(South_Africa)
Of course I wouldn't have to go through all this trouble if you knew what you are talking about but alas, I have to explain yet again what you should know.
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DA-DBN-GUY
Respect10The "complaining" you say the DA do is not complaining but trying to keep the anc honest. The anc has tried to undermine the constitution numerous times and the DA as the opposition has a duty to set them straight. The DA do try and say what they will do for the people but are called a racist, elitist white party with coconuts. have yet to hear the DA use racist tactics to win votes. The DA had always been around but just known by different names. The anc doesnt have a product only its history as a liberation movement that it uses to play the guilt card to ensure the previously disadvantaged carry on voting for them.
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYAA is not working bcos it only benefits those aligned with the leaders of the anc. AA was intended to advance the blacks due to reverse the effect apartheid had on blacks in the workplace. But we have a situation where blacks are put into positions merely bcos they are black and NOT neccessarily qualified for the position.
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Only benefits those that are aligned to the ANC, how do you figure that out?
Does the ANC sit on interview panels; your logic is all over the place. You don’t seem to understand AA, its implementation and its flaws, by bringing ANC into AA you expose your ignorance.
I keep on asking how old you guys are not because age is important but your views are so naive you can only be young and impressionable to make the kind of statements you guys make. If an unqualified individual is placed in a position of power then that is not AA, it is window-dressing and is bound to fail. That is not what AA is about, it would help if you understood this fact.
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUY May I ask why you debate on this website. Is it to exchange views and opinion, to learn from others, to preach or to stroke your ego?That question is important because you miss the point of engaging in a debate public or otherwise and we now seem to be debating to win debates rather than share information and decide which position or argument makes sense.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelThen obviously you too dont understand AA. AA means placing a previously disadvantaged person into a advertised position above a white person if they have similar qualifications and experience. I know of companies that HAVE to appoint a black person into certain positions regardless. AA is also used to make companies BEE compliant. This is an anc policy. This goes for municipalities as well as the private sector. AA is an anc policy
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYThe "complaining" you say the DA do is not complaining but trying to keep the anc honest. The anc has tried to undermine the constitution numerous times and the DA as the opposition has a duty to set them straight. The DA do try and say what they will do for the people but are called a racist, elitist white party with coconuts. have yet to hear the DA use racist tactics to win votes.
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Please expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelDA-DBN-GUY May I ask why you debate on this website. Is it to exchange views and opinion, to learn from others, to preach or to stroke your ego?
That question is important because you miss the point of engaging in a debate public or otherwise and we now seem to be debating to win debates rather than share information and decide which position or argument makes sense.
I hopefully try and learn as i am open minded but at times it is difficult when one encounters another who doesnt provide facts to their "debates' but merely opinions and then tries to rubbish off others who provide facts. Asking a persons age is not a valid debating tool neither is sarcasm.
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Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYThen obviously you too dont understand AA. AA means placing a previously disadvantaged person into a advertised position above a white person if they have similar qualifications and experience.
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Yes that is the de.finition but do you und.erstand the log.ic be.hind AA and what it tries to ac.hieve?
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BlackSeed
SOLUTIONSHardy, sowetan does not provide clues as to what is vulgar or not so I had to shy away from your method.
I meant DA must be doing something right for them to win votes; similar to why ANC is keeping votes don’t you think?
Then why is the DA opposition? Why do they want to topple ANC if they don’t have to ensure that ANC delivers?
As for calling people idiots, I’ll leave you with that self-inflicted frustration; unfortunately there’s nothing I can do other than advising you not to call people idiots when they don’t agree with you. I didn’t want to Google since you have answers but I guess I thought wrong, besides, I don’t just trust literature.
I give thanks to your good heart for sharing healthy food with the hungry, so long as it’s not for vanity.
We all need a rest after slavery. More hours of work will only keep those children hungry when you can’t wake up anymore because of hard work. A rest is needed, even the Gods rests.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DZELPlease expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
The anc play the race card every election without fail. You had JM calling whites thieves at the last municipal election, the anc accusing the DA of sabotaging their campaign in Soweto, accused the DA of using a speech by Trvor Manuel out of context to garner more votes, the anc altering a DA poster and having it in the back ground during an interview on tv and the list goes on.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelI do understand the log ic behind it and dont have a problem with it IF it were implemented correctly which it is not.
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel is confusing AA and cadre deploymentReport Abuse
HFVerwoerd
come sit on my lap and i will tell you about cadre deployment which dzel is trying to muggle up with aa and bee. you see the party currently in power takes the dumbest freak it can get its hands on and then forces an entity to make him a director or ceo, even though he needs help tying his own shoes.Report Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYI hopefully try and learn as i am open minded but at times it is difficult when one encounters another who doesnt provide facts to their "debates' but merely opinions and then tries to rubbish off others who provide facts. Asking a persons age is not a valid debating tool neither is sarcasm.
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Firstly age is important as it is an indicator of one's experiences, experience and knowledge. The younger one is the more likely they are to be naive which certainly is the case when discussing our past.
Also we need to be very careful of how we define "facts", posting a wikipedia li.nk does not amount to providing facts so comprehending what is a fact and what isn't is important. Sometimes a debate should be based on analysis of a situation or a document, by definition analysis can never be fact as it is essentially an opinion as you correctly state. You've asked me to provide proof that the DA is anti-AA, obviously there is no document that states this outright but breaking down official DA policy coupled with an understanding of what AA is and what it seeks to address it is not difficult to surmise the DA is not genuine about their hijacked version as it seeks to undermine the very intention of the concept.
I'd trust you are intelligent enough to understand that fact, because of apartheid being race based any solution to reverse the impact thereof must be along the very same racial lines and if we measure success we have to look at whether the standard and quality of life amongst the designated group is improving. Any thing else is not AA, telling me I should be converted by this non-racial concept defeats the very idea behind AA.
Of course education is important but don't insult our collective intelligence by arguing that education should replace AA, only the naive and unassuming would buy that line and the DA stinks we are stupid enough to believe anything and everything they tell us.
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- hahahaha!!! so there is no facts that the da is against bee/aa so therefore we just have to analyse and make up stories as we gio along, yirre this oake cracks me upReport Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYI do understand the log ic behind it and dont have a problem with it IF it were implemented correctly which it is not.
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No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
Don't claim you understand the objective, explain it to me so I can see if you really understand the objectives.
Even if you do can you discuss the impact of rising income within communities with any degree of intelligence?
Do you think AA should be scrapped and why?
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- hahahaha! for someone who says we should be careful how we define "facts" you sure type the word "fact" along with the beeskak you writeReport Abuse
HFVerwoerd
Dzel --No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
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yirre boet, its only stupid people that say education isnt important
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Dzel
HFVerwoerdDzel --
No you don't otherwise you would not be punting education as an alternative.
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yirre boet, its only stupid people that say education isnt important
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Stop making an idiot of yourself and improve your comprehension skills, maybe then I will give you the attention you so desperately want.
Just grow up dude.
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DA-DBN-GUY
Dzelthere is no document that states this outright but breaking down official DA policy coupled with an understanding of what AA is and what it seeks to address it is not difficult to surmise the DA is not genuine about their hijacked version as it seeks to undermine the very intention of the concept.
So then this is your opinion and not a fact so therefeore your point is mute? As I have already said I am not anti AA just the way it is being implemented and seemingly only benefitting those with ties to the anc, in municipal circles that is, I dont think I said education should replace AA merely stating that it is more important than AA. Because without adequate education AA will always fail. You should feel your "collective intelligence" is being insulted by a regime that says it is doing well and uplifting the country. Dude it is the anc that thinks you are stupid bcos you, not meaning you personally, keep voting for them regardless how they continue to fail the country.
Do you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- jirre boet, jys maar lekker evasive ne, laat my dink aan n nat onderbroek - are you also a tenderpreneur? cause you have to be as dum as a plank for that job - or you are window dressing?Report Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYPlease expand on the definition of racist tactics, cite examples of a party that has used these tactics to win votes so I understand the point you think you are making.
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Does putting a black face on a poster with the sole intention that the electorate will identify with the race of that said individual and vote for the said party not qualify as racist. Is this not racial profiling and isn't racial profile racist by definition?
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HFVerwoerd
this dezel fellow seems to be the only one that is talking fallacy but calls it fact -- jirrie boet you must work for governmentReport Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYDo you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
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Has the black-middle class not grown since '94, you know what marketers call black diamonds. What do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class and is it made of of ANC cadres as you think?
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- what do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
merely the removal of apartheid guy the current black middle class are the people that are go getters and that made it themselves - did you honestly think the anc got there there? no boet
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Dzel
HFI am not in the habit of entertaining idiots, from what you've posted here and judging by your nick you come across as a Class A idiot. Consider this the first and last response directed at you unless you grow up very quickly. People like you dispel the myth that whites are intellectually superior.
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The-Rothschilds
Z.ille spe.aks a lot of s.enseWe shou.ld ha.ve po.litical par.ties who put the coun.tries fut.ure before who le.ads it at M.angaung.
The D.A has made it cle.ar what it is all about. It wis.hes to use f.ree market prin.cipals & bet.ter educ.ation to get to an e.conomic gr.owth of 8% whic.h is requir.ed to make any signific.ant cha.nge in the stan.dard of livi.ng of all South Africans.
A.A and BE.E have f.ailed m.iserably. because both polic.ies did not cr.eate any new jo.bs or busine.sses. This is why our u.nemployment has stag.nated over the past 10 years. The ANC is good at blam.ing A.partheid and the Global c.risis of 2008 but really they should si.t dow.n and look and see that they have never ado.pted polic.ies that would cause the pri.vate sec.tor to gr.ow fa.st eno.ugh to see a differ.ence in the tri.ple c.risis we liv.e in.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DzelDA-DBN-GUY
Do you think the "quality of life amongst the designated group is improving"? I dont think any person in their right mind could say yes? Maybe a few selected individuals are benefitting but not the collective.
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Has the black-middle class not grown since '94, you know what marketers call black diamonds. What do you think is the driver behind this growing black middle class and is it made of of ANC cadres as you think?
Indeed it has grown and yes it is certainly made up of cadres. Here in KZN we hve the Mpisanes who form obscurity suddenly became rich over night thanks to Shawns mother being in the DBN municipality and getting her daughter lucrative tenders despite the fact she was blacklisted for fraud. Look at the Aurora mine owners. Connected to Zoomer and Madiba. Coincidence? Doubt it. Roux Shabangu being offered deals despite not always being the cheapest.
"Does putting a black face on a poster with the sole intention that the electorate will identify with the race of that said individual and vote for the said party not qualify as racist"
Please enlighten me if you can how the above can be construed as racist? Doesnt calling a certain race thieves classify as racist?
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Tasto
Am I being blocked now?Report Abuse
Dzel
DA-DBN-GUYSo then this is your opinion and not a fact so therefeore your point is mute?
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Logic my friend, can you analyse and reason through an idea until you reach a logical conclusion?
My point is not moot, I don't need an official document to validate its soundness, you are welcome to give alternative analysis but you too are still to explain how this need-based AA will work in reality cause you can't.
As much as I don't have reasons to vote for the ANC I have no reasons to vote for the DA because they do not take me as an individual and a black person seriously instead they think putting up a picture of Lindiwe will convince me, do you even comprehend how insulting that assumption is?
It says I am stupid, brainless and only see in colour.
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HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- so boet i dont have any documents as proof but using logic i can deduce that the ruling party and all its leaders are all baby-killing satanists who sacrifice virgins? and i dont need any factious evidence to validate its soundness? seems like you were the type of guy at school who wants everyone to debate but as soon as you dont agere with him then he storms off am i right?Report Abuse
HFVerwoerd
Dzel -- and are you trying to tell us that the black middle class are so useless that they couldnt have made it without bee or aa?Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
DZELPlease tell me how having a pic of Lindiwe on a DA poster is racist. Dying to hear your reasoning.
AA will never work bcos the anc have used it to benefit their cadres and friends, in government, and not the collective. AA will only work if you pit qualification and or experience against each other.
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DA-DBN-GUY
DZELYou would rather see Lindiwe and all other black reps in the DA as window dressing based on your assumptions rather than focus on the FACT that they were elected into their respective positions. You are close minded and see the DA as "white" when in fact the FACTS show otherwise.
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HFVerwoerd
DA-DBN-GUY - Janee boet, lindiwe as window dressing meanwhile we have all these ceos and directors in the state companies who are nothing more but window dressing and cost us millions and then we get the inefitable golden handshake at the end of their term what is all this drama with SABC now? the company is bankrupt cant even show local sports games, all the management are being charged for corruption but they all receive golden handshakes and dzel is going on about window dressing.Report Abuse
The-Rothschilds
DzelHFVerwoerd
Dzel -- and are you trying to tell us that the black middle class are so useless that they couldnt have made it without bee or aa?
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Of course it completely es.capes you that Afrik.aners had their own version of AA and BEE stretching back to '48 only they called it apa.rtheid.
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You are basing your assumption on the fact that black people had companies before apartheid of which the apartheid government forced those companies to hire white people, which is completely not true. No jobs were stolen from black people, the white people created their jobs.
AA today is just an excuse law to force white people to give up their jobs.
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The-Rothschilds
AA and BEE are failed policies and are election ploys to gather votes.They dont make economic sense but make political sense for the political party proposing such laws.
However, without economic sense as Julius Malema would say, renders political sense useless.
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