Wed Jun 19 09:59:32 SAST 2013

'SA democracy is a nightmare'

Sep 4, 2012 | Sapa | 58 comments

"It's difficult to believe that people are pocketing so much money, and have so much privilege, while the masses suffer in shacks"

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Wed Jun 19 09:59:33 SAST 2013 ::
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Sep 4, 2012

Mosquer

O ka botšiša gape
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Sep 4, 2012

kolobe

maybe malema should start his own party, anc in incapable
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Sep 4, 2012

truthhurt

And yet we have days that are commemorated "Freedom day" which i dont celebrate, i dont know what freedom is, i have never experienced it.

Some people would ague that my life would have been differant had the ANC not fought for the little freedom we have, the true is that some people are more free than others.

The question is how free do you feel as an individual?
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Sep 4, 2012

MommaC

Bish, take a holiday. Go visit with your friend the Dalai Lama and don't pick up a newspaper for a few weeks. I share your frustration but you are letting it get to you. We need you strong, healthy and with your perspectives in place.
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Sep 4, 2012

VENDALIOUS

Tutu is a attention seeker just like Julius malima
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Sep 4, 2012

tumi85

Our government"ÁNC' don't know they are doing to south Africans but only corruptions that whats they graduated with PhDs
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Sep 4, 2012

Chabella

Anything but the ANC !!
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Sep 4, 2012

Chabella

we should all read this.
www.politicsweb.co.za/politicsweb/view/politicsweb/en/page71619?oid=323736&sn=Detail&pid=71616

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Sep 4, 2012

star88

What is democracy ???
Where is thee sait of all saints, Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela ???

During CODESA, Cyril Ramaphosa was the mouthpeace of Mandela and Roelf Meyer was the mouthpeace of De Klerk. We know that De Klerk still stands by the apartheid policies and in 2012 he went to the BBC and told the world that the homeland policy was the best policy. On the other hand, Ramaphosa (a black former unionist) gained massive profits and a lot of money from the investment in a Lonmin mines - fast foward to 2012 to the Marikana massacre.

Today, the Madelas live like royalty, on the blood of the many poor masses who still live in appaling conditions.

Thandiswa Mazwai said it in her hit song: "Zabalaza" as well as Letta Mbulu who said "Not yet uhuru"

Desmond Tutu, you are part of the problem - with all due respect!
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Sep 4, 2012

Sugaar

'SA democracy is a nightmare' under the ledership of showerhead a zuluuboy from ikandla.

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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

@Sugaar...This is tribalist. Why are you not thinking?

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Sep 4, 2012

Dandalo

Total los of leadership. The whole ANC leadership is in a mess. Two weeks ago Metthew Phosa went to eskom and demanded business for his lilly white company where he is having shares. This is at the expense of transformation which would be benefiting the masses in shacks. Amazingly Phosa will be elected again in the ANC's top six. We can't always blame the master, but the slave give the master authority to enslave them.
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Sep 4, 2012

Mosquer

DJ-Winner
@Sugaar...This is tribalist. Why are you not thinking?
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you don't want anything ka zoooma ne??
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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

@Dandalo...unfortunately ordinary poor SA people are not allowed to vote in Manguang. Only about 2000 fat cats will be eligable to vote.
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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

Mosquer
DJ-Winner
@Sugaar...This is tribalist. Why are you not thinking?
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you don't want anything ka zoooma ne??
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This is not about Zuma, but there is a lot of Zulus in this site. Zulus will be reading this and don't you think it will negatively affect them?
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Sep 4, 2012

malemaforpresident

It's difficult to believe that people are pocketing so much money, and have so much privilege, while the masses suffer in shacks,” he said
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But Tutu with due respect those people in shacks are the one voting for the same ANC so what You are the one to walk around the country amongst shacks the likes of Alexander township with a loud speaker to campaign against the ANC. Just have a look at Hollywood Nkandla of the President and the surrounding mud houses so who is going to correct the imbalances God? atlist you are next to God because you are an Arch bishop so you still stand a chance to change things in this country before passing on
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Sep 4, 2012

Maratachelete

Tutu,this is where you come in to ask God to intervene and save this beautiful country of ours.It is only prayer that can alter the current situation in our country.
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Sep 4, 2012

jnrb

When you jump out of an aeroplane without a parachute, do you expect to land safely on the ground? Likewise if you elect a man with Std 3 qualification as president to lead the country, what do you expect? The first thing he’ll do is organize his buddy’s early release on parole which actually makes a joke of the whole judiciary. Then 3 years later he’ll do it again. No reason to be surprised Mr Tutu.
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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

jnrb
When you jump out of an aeroplane without a parachute, do you expect to land safely on the ground? Likewise if you elect a man with Std 3 qualification as president to lead the country, what do you expect?
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He was serving 10 years in jail for your freedom while the rest were studying comfortable. He was arrested for your freedom that you are free today to call him all these stupid names.
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Sep 4, 2012

Flemza

Now the Archbishop Emeritus Desmond Tutu , what must we do , some of us we have educated ourselves and still are , so what must we do if now we are reaping the rewards of that education , no one was stopped from educating himself , in 1989 I was a farm laboureer , now I`m a black diamond I never killed or enslaved anyone to be what I`m , so what must I do if people they don`t want to improve them selves , why should we blame Zuma , what can Zuma do if you don`t want to improve your life , right now people are toying toying for 315% increase without a minimum education Matric , where in the world have u seen that , Malema encouraging to make this country ungovernable intstead of telling them to get any education and be able to have a basic understanding of the agonomics of life , please the mighty Archbishop Emeritus Desmond Tutu let us enjoy our hard earned living , let those who still think there is manner from heaven keep on praying , maybe one day it will be
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Sep 4, 2012

Lehido

The Bishop has a lot of issues with government because he was there when freedom was fught for, he saw people die......and today people who did nothing, and some were not even there are pocketing millions for doing fokol..........it pains the old man's bald.........
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Sep 4, 2012

Fingaz

As a pionner and authur of that freedom you should be ashamed that you sold us out and in the process created a monster that is not pro the masses> Are we realy free?
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Sep 4, 2012

Sthibolibo

not SA democracy but the ANC government.The very same people who claim to have been the struggle veterans
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Sep 4, 2012

Tusedi

Go ahead sowetan dont publish my comment, nx truth hurts
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Sep 4, 2012

MGEEZ

@VENDALIOUS
Tutu is a attention seeker just like Julius malima
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How so? Please expanciate!!!
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Sep 4, 2012

JohnStone

Men of the Word must understand the difference between the "promise of democracy" and the "promise of paradise". Where in the world is democracy perfect? Stop deluding yourself oldman, the only place wherein "perfection" exist is in the grave. As long as human beings are involved, not programmed machines, there will always exist flaws, I mean serious flaws, even the machines are not flawless because they are made by men.

Former British Prime Minister Winston Churchill had the following to say about politics and perfection:
1. What is a politician? Churchill's answer; "The ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow, next week, next month and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen"

2.On perfection: "The high belief in the perfection of man is appropriate in a man of the cloth (read Tutu) but not in a Prime Minister (read politician)"

Since Tutu is Anglican by religion, I would advise him to read more of Winston Churchill, another great English stateman of our not soo distant past.
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Sep 4, 2012

Mellow

Arch I feel your frustration really especially after the so called democracy its pathetic to say the least
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Sep 4, 2012

Tusedi

MGEEZ

Tutu was one of the people who help usher they new democracy and they were part of the group who had an influence on the future of this country. Now they realised that they failed the people and are starting to blame govnmnt and zuma and the democracy that they say they fought for. We are the most democratic country in africa and so what happens here is the by people's choise.
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Sep 4, 2012

Bebesocs

@Sugaar..SA democracy is a nightmare under the leadership of showerhead a zuluuboy from ikandla...Even if it was somebody else things would have been like this, I do not want to put blame solely on president Zuma but to the gang in Luthuli house, unfortunately we have hard hearted people like Motshekga.
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Sep 4, 2012

candilious

@Mellow- Ek wil net opgooi duk naar vir die k@K


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Sep 4, 2012

candilious

@Bebesocs- Agreed by i would say the Whole of the ANC ,none of them have the peoples interest at heart and thats a FACT!!!!
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Sep 4, 2012

Mellow

Maratachelete
Tutu,this is where you come in to ask God to intervene and save this beautiful country of ours.It is only prayer that can alter the current situation in our country.
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PRAYER? REALLY?! people are suffering and we think of prayer as the solution?
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Sep 4, 2012

22112JO

ONE OU ONE A PEACE PRIZE 2 2 1 1 2.. I FULLY AGREE WITH THE HON. TUTU OUR GOVERNMENT HAS FAILED THE PEOPLE IN MANY WAYS. THE GOVERNMENT INHERITED TWO THINGS..1.) A SMALL TAX PAYER BASE OF 5,000,000 SUPPORTING 15,000,000 SUBSIDIZED OF THE POOR.
2.) THE PRODUCTIVITY OF THE AVERAGE IN PRODUCING POOR PEOPLE OVER THE PAST 100 OR MORE YEARS..IT IS NOT THE PROGRESSIVE PEOPLE WHO SUFFER BUT THE ALREADY POOR.
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Sep 4, 2012

Mellow

@Candy Hi friendship like you said yesterday its gets worse by the day

@22112JO I feel your frustration boet but screaming aint gonna help
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Sep 4, 2012

_Sinudeity

Mellow - "I feel your frustration boet but screaming aint gonna help"

Hehe, tell that to Desmond Tutu.
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Sep 4, 2012

B_BIKO27

Do u call democray this? Ya'll being delusional. The anc is law onto themselves The majority of the people were against the move to disband the scorpions did they listen? Will we ever know the truth about arms deal? Will the NPA ever give zille the tapes. Why can't they fire Angie and we all know that secrecy bill is here to stay the anc made up their minds but then again electing zuma as our president says a lot about our way thinking.. doesn't it. As long as anc continues to have more than 60% of seats in parliament it will never be a healthy democracy
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Sep 4, 2012

ILLUMINATED

Tutu the Jesuit!!!

Everytime I read Edmond Paris - The Secret History of the Jesuits, Tutu comes to mind. I wonder by what capacity and whose authority is he in and out of the White House?

@Vendalicious and Star88

Spot on.

@JohnStone

You are the man...

@DJ Winner

DJ-Winner
jnrb
When you jump out of an aeroplane without a parachute, do you expect to land safely on the ground? Likewise if you elect a man with Std 3 qualification as president to lead the country, what do you expect?
......................................................
He was serving 10 years in jail for your freedom while the rest were studying comfortable. He was arrested for your freedom that you are free today to call him all these stupid names.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Please stop being myopic and gullible, when all these "prisoner criminals" were in jail, what were we doing outside? Sitting and crying? We all fought for the pathetic "Hegelian dialect" style Freedom, we were shot at, arrested etc. So stop this illusion of so-called "freedom fighters" who were in prison and some ran into exile.
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Sep 4, 2012

Patsekg

The ANC must wakeup now or South Africa will become another Tunisia or Egypt. Marikana is just the beginning of times. The ANC must bear in mind that a lot of people out there are destitute and hopeless. They have lost faith in the ANC and government, the widening gap between the poor and the rich is going to explode into something undesirable. People are fighting for positions and tenders while negleting the poor. One day the poor will organise themselves and do something that no one wants to even think of. Who thought that Hosni Mubarak of Egypt can one day be topled by ordinary people on the ground? One other thing which i think South African Government need to do is to take all the foreigners back to their own countries, tighten the security at our borders, feed its own people first, ensure that all South Africans are looked after before everyone else, and then allow the foreigners back into the country again but this time, with stricter conditions. Foreigners must be given a certain period of time and after that time has expired, they must go home, especially Nigerians who are not assylum seeckers but are only here to sell drugs. The salaries of the Exacutives must be looked at, how can a member of parliament earn around R900 000,00 per annum for doing nothing? We both know that their job is to sleep and only wakeup when it's time to vote or clap hands for the president, yet they earn much more than what other presidents in other countries earn. How come one man gets more than R3 million in bonuses for running a company down? These are some of the examples i can give. However, like Smarts Nghonyama once said that he did not join the struggle to be poor, but that should never be at the expense of the poor. ANC, wakeup now, the country will burn as a result of self enrichment by the elite.
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Sep 4, 2012

Tabza325is

@Flemza, relax man no one wants to take your education and success away from you, I think the hard thing for most to do is to share eath's wealth, those that made it in life find it hard to be charitable which is by choice not force, as a result keep accumilating more wealth than what a person could spend in thier life time, example look as Carlose Sim in Mexico, he is the richest man in the world in a third world country, he claims when he dies as part of his will we wants his accumilated wealth to be used to build Mexico's infrastructure, which is a good gesture, but how many billioniers do you know who are willing to help the poor of this world, did you know if the richest people in the world donate only 1% of their yearly income it's enough to end world hunger in poor country's, but by choice no one will donate this money, it's a choice the rich make in this world. Think of it this way yes it's your success and no one is forcing you to share or help make the world a better place for all but if you are Jesus what would you do?
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Sep 4, 2012

jnrb

@ DJ Winner

"He was serving 10 years in jail for your freedom while the rest were studying comfortable. He was arrested for your freedom that you are free today to call him all these stupid names."
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So the fact that he sat in jail gives him the right to break the law (arms deal – he pulled every trick in the book to make sure he didn't have his day in court. Why was he so worried about the documents in Mauritius?), to release his pals from prison, to tolerate ineptitude from his ministers (school book saga). It is because of this attitude of yours that the whole of Africa is in the mess it is. Look at Angola : Eduardo Dos Santos has been president since 1979 (the MPLA fought for freedom from Portugal) and has amassed a personal fortunate of billions. Angola is the second-biggest oil producer in sub-Saharan Africa, turning out more than 1.9 million barrels per day. Yet if you have ever been to Angola you will see the poverty in which millions live. The money never seems to reach the people. That is so typical of Africa. In many African countries which gained independence since 1960 onwards there is usually a stadium called "Freedom Park" and a street called "Independence Avenue" but the fact is there has been a decline in life expectancy, literacy levels and per capita income ever since independence. Leaders who think they are above the law is the cancer of Africa.

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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

ILLUMINATED
Tutu the Jesuit!!!

Everytime I read Edmond Paris - The Secret History of the Jesuits, Tutu comes to mind. I wonder by what capacity and whose authority is he in and out of the White House?

@Vendalicious and Star88

Spot on.

@JohnStone

You are the man...

@DJ Winner

DJ-Winner
jnrb
When you jump out of an aeroplane without a parachute, do you expect to land safely on the ground? Likewise if you elect a man with Std 3 qualification as president to lead the country, what do you expect?
......................................................
He was serving 10 years in jail for your freedom while the rest were studying comfortable. He was arrested for your freedom that you are free today to call him all these stupid names.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Please stop being myopic and gullible, when all these "prisoner criminals" were in jail, what were we doing outside? Sitting and crying? We all fought for the pathetic "Hegelian dialect" style Freedom, we were shot at, arrested etc. So stop this illusion of so-called "freedom fighters" who were in prison and some ran into exile.
.......................................................................................
What were you doing outside I don't know, but we know that Zuma was arrested for our freedom. People criticised his qualification and I responded that he did not have a freedom for comfortable education because he was in jail.
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Sep 4, 2012

Sekgonkgothela

Tutu is merely a voice of concience. In what way is he part of the problem? He is no saint and is also bound to be fallible. You may have tons of money to buy a buffalo for R28m and let your worker wash it next to his living quarters on the farm....fine, that is the way you choose to live and spend your money - but where is your sense of altruism?
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Sep 4, 2012

MokankanyaneM

At least Tutu will always speak his mind, regardless of who approves or not.
Remember Mandela was once reprimanded for trying to speak his mind?
Tutu is not a card carrying memeber of any party, so he will always say it as he sees it.As for those who think Malema is a Godsend, go to his hometown Seshego and ask.
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Sep 4, 2012

ChampRef

HAAI maan, ke kopa le tlogeleng NTATE ZUMA tuu, man HE is still the PRESIDENT of this country. Please respect him whilst he is still serving tuu. UBUNTUNYANA SO.
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Sep 4, 2012

Papage

They were there, but did they hear him, No, o kare tsebe tsa bona di kwetswe ka makaka a dikolobe. ANC now is rotten, and they dont care. Zuma what are you doing with your people?
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Sep 4, 2012

DJ-Winner

@jnrb...People questioned his education and I told them that he was arrested while other people were studying. I don't know about other things you are ranting about...
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Sep 4, 2012

Tasto

Aagh man come up with something we didn't know for the past 18 years !!
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Sep 4, 2012

Winilen

Mr Tutu, what happen to the TRC i believe you were in charge, y did it fail is because you were paid off? Chris Hani we stil not sure of y he was killed but the TRC was there at the time.
Now that the ANC has cut you off, you sounding like Malema always bad mouthing the ANC.
You all the same just lookin for ur own A$$es
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Sep 4, 2012

Tasto

Bishop I saw your name associated with PRASA and given the horrible stories abt Metrorail this is similar to the top politicians with share @Lonmin mining company whoare speaking in tongues or with forked tongue !! Don't throw stones if u live a a glass house !!
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Sep 4, 2012

mambaaai

the Tutu , Mandela , Walther Sisulu time is looooong gone.... now we are just left with opportunist pigs in a trough
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Sep 4, 2012

WarrenG

Aren't the ANC embarrassed about the way they're running our country??? Can't they see that everyone knows what a bad job they're doing? Can't they tell that people are getting pis.sed off, and will soon turn on them? Don't they want to make the country a success for all of us who live in it? The Archbishop is correct. This democracy is a nightmare.
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Sep 4, 2012

MSG_S

If this is the way of democracy, the democracy that they were and are braging about, then I hate democracy. Really. If this is all about, well the previous regime would have been better than this if it was not for racial segregation and unequal rights to SAs people. Maybe someone can explain that this is democracy mis-interpreted or mis-used or even severely abused. The only solution is for this spear-headed political party swoped by voting against it in Mangaung and or amalgamation of the parties into governance.
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Sep 4, 2012

skwamasamabele

truthhurt- The ANC did not fight for freedom. Visit any township graveyard to locate the freedom fighters who liberated this country. The ANC was sitting in exile, throwing a bomb or two there and there, milking all the attention. Why do you think the Leadership are alien to our problems? because they have nothing in common with the REAL Freedom fighters who liberated the last country on Motherland.
Tutu is right. He knows we (80's activists) fought to dislodge the National Party from power, yet we are left out of the pie.
SOLUTION: WE NEED TO TAKE THE AFRICAN NATIONAL CONGRESS AWAY FROM THESE VULTURES, REINSTATE THE FREEDOM CHARTER AS THE CONSTITUTION AND START BY DISTRIBUTING THE LAND
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Sep 5, 2012

S'bo

One thing about democracy that I like is that you always get what you vote for. Since most South Africans are ignorant of what is happening within government or are being willfully blind because of their blind loyalty to so called liberation movements and personalities. Let them suffer so they learn to chose wisely next time.
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Sep 7, 2012

M'Lungu

Eish! 100% for the TUTS!
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Sep 8, 2012

CB045

The ANC is a racist government similar to the Apartheid we had under white rule. However, because the government is now black, it matters not to the outside world how the common citizens of this country suffer as long as they can reap all the benefits they possibly can. Since we now have 9 provinces instead of 4 and still incapable of managing them because of stupid and power-crazy people in government, the ANC is doing a damn good job of destroying the country each year.
TV personalities, although not fluent in the English language presents programs more suited to the White group, but because of its racist policy, Blacks are preferred. As the country gets poorer, more blacks will die and suffer. The skilled Whites will simply leave our shores as will the rich Blacks will simply move to other African or European states.
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Sep 11, 2012

Mossgado_

Oh! I love this OLD men_ Viva "TUTU" Viva...
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Sep 19, 2012

Baltisd

It is very simple to see that democracy is a lie and a confidence-trick. All you have to do is analyse what it is supposed to be and then compare that definition to the reality.

Democracy is supposed to be the rule of the majority. Government of the majority of the people, for the majority of the people, by the majority of the people.

Let us now compare the smooth deceptive definition, to stark reality.

In the western world approximately 95% of the wealth is possessed by approximately 5% of the people. That means, using these same figures, that 95% of the people, the overwhelming majority, possess only 5% of the wealth.

The politicians would have us all believe that this is the will of the majority. That is the politician's idea of what they call democracy.

When did the 95% of people, the overwhelming majority, ever vote for the right for themselves to be poor and vote for the tiny 5% minority to possess their own (the poor people's) share of the nation's wealth, that the poor majority's ancestors have fought and died to protect?

The Ruler of the Universe has prohibited democracy because He knew that the rich would use it and other means to deceive and rip everyone else off; keep the majority down and poor; just as He wrote, via His Prophets in The Bible.
http://jahtruth.net/democra.htm

So what to do about it?
http://sa.2012jubilee.info

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