What happened here now? No more comments? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Kaylae
We just need harsh sentences here in SA.other countries crime is less cause of the consequences but what does SA do feed,educate and house them Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Kaylae
Danielrjvvuren
What happened here now? No more comments?
_______________________________________________
Yep Dan no more comments#shocked# Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
What happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?
As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
Kaylae
It doesn't take much to confuse me and for a second I thought I was being played for the fool? All my comment gone. hahah Oh Sowetan how we love thee.... Report Abuse
Sowetan what's the point of commenting if you just gonna remove them comments eish I have a better solution for y'all just block comments on this story and save us all from your silly stunts Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Warren
I say S.A. did fail and is still failing to protect its youth from heartless foreign drug dealers and human traffickers by allowing an almost uncontrolled access to the country by all sorts of foreign undesirables. The massive wave of foreigners into the country should have been better planned for and neccesary measures put in place to protect our youth and other citizens from whatever negative influences it brings with it.
The youth in schools are now suddenly exposed to alien types of drugs and influences and those are directly to blame for more than fifty percent of young inmates in prison for crimes ranging from theft,robbery,murder e.t.c. The influence of drugs is always present in those crimes.
The gov. can implement some serious damage control by jacking up our Justice and Home Affairs functions.
As one of the options,we need designated special courts with specialized prosecutors and minimum sentence for all drug related offences and human trafficking to protect our youth and our communities from the foreign chemical/drug onslaught. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
CYBORICO
@Momma c
it still takes a village to raise a kid, just that the villages r left with self centered adults who dont give a bf$%ck about others but themselves, just yersteday the same people were saying all loads of gabage on the article of that radio DJ who wanted to get closer to his family, when the rape cases get reported the same people talk K$k as if the rapist all emerged from the soil or from space Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Lehido
The youth must also play the part in protecting themselves...... Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
CYBORICO
I'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
@Lehido
The youth must also play the part in protecting themselves
cum on now, youth need guidence, otherwise they always make the wrong desicions which at the time seem right to them. the youth always want to test the boundries and this can be costly at times. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Warren
The case this week of a shoolkid selling drug laced muffins at school drives home the unfortunate truth that every single parent must know,whether they accept it or not,that their child has a 50/50 probability of becoming a drug addict just by merely attending school. As a parent,you can only do so much to protect your child from that exposure by warning them and talking to them,the rest still rests with the authorities who are mandated to stop and discourage those drugs from reaching our schools and communities. The police alone cant do that when the courts still treat drug offences just like any other crime with five hundred rands bail and normal sentences. The ease with which those foreign drug dealers also move around and reach our kids at school is a complete failure to protect our kids on the side of home affairs.
@Momma C.
It takes a village to raise a child but if that village has a Nigerian drug dealer operating in it, it is no more that simple to raise that child when he or she has a strong craving for a drug fix.
In order to protect our youth,drug offences cant continue being handled in normal courts by the usual prosecutors and drug sentences cant continue being considered as ordinary crimes. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
CYBORICO
@Mommac
I'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
Where did those days go
I am in my early thrities but surely remember those days, the days when a motorist will stop his car and come out with a shambok just because we was playing soccer on the street, when adults will chase away young girls standing with boys in the corners of dusty old mzansi, i was there Momma but surely am not as matured as u sound but I am working on it Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
QueenLuu
MommaC
What happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?
As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies
###########################################
Children have rights in SA. Parents who spank their children could soon be slapped with criminal charges - if a children's rights lobby group gets its way so there's really very little a village can do.
I say that SA has failed their youth under the anc. Firstly the anc has instilled a sense of entitlement and the belief that one must just take what one wants without having to work for it. Next they dumbed down the education system so that a matric now days is not worth the paper its printed on or is easily forged. Then you have certain 'youth leaders' who promote teen pregnancies and encourage it for the revolution??? The parents of these teen pregnancies drop out of school to look after their kids and many resort to prostitution to get money as they dont have skills or education to find decent jobs. Its a vicious cycle started by the anc and will continue until they are out voted! Report Abuse
LOL
I can remember going to parties and when the Aunties decided it was getting late now, they'd come out (curlers and all) with brooms, mops and wooden spoons to chase us all home. If they tried to do that today, they'd probably get beaten up or shot, so I suppose it is understandable why they don't involve themselves any more. Those were good days though. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
I will repeat my previous, no deleted, comment. There are institutions in place to help the youth, but these institutions or too busy having intra and inter organizational conflict and fighting over crap such as what is in the ground and the ground itself it is completely missing the youth problems. We need an organization that can stand for youth issues such as education and not wanting advancements of the organization itself and if you guys think I'm only talking about ANCYL no this statement includes the DA's allusive youth league too Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Warren
@Momma C
I'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
Where did those days go?
----------------------------------------------------------------
Those days are certainly gone. How do you grab a child by the ear when he is high on drugs and so transformed that even his own parents and teachers are afraid to touch him?
Youth cant really be expected to protect themselves against those influences without the help of authorities who must and CAN make sure that most of those drugs do not reach our youth,especially at schools. That is why other countries have a straight death sentence to protect their youth and communities against drugs. Their countries are not drug dealers' paradise like we are becoming. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
QueenLuu
@TKay true and yet the government wants to take that away too.
@DBN guy thats a very sad truth hey. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
DA-DBN-GUY
QueenLuu
If this country had youth leaders that actually fought for the youth and issues affecting the youth then i am sure there would be far less going to jail and having kids while still a kid themselves. Yet we ahve youth leaders marching for nationalisation, displeasure with Limpopo being put under administration and the leadership of Botswana. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
9janavy
Mr Mininster,no Government in the world is perfect.The problem with yours is cadre deployment, instead of appointing people with experience and proper knowledge of their portfolio in top positions, you guys appoint relatives and friends even though some of them are ex-convicts.It is the worst kind of nepotism i have ever witnessed in any country in the world.
Secondly you need to stop protecting big monopolistic cooperations like Telkom, Ackermans,HiFi cooperation e.t.c and give room for healthy competition.In the last two years you guys have messed up everything with your ridiculous laws.One time it used to take two weeks to register a CC now that you changed the law and mandated every one to register a Pty some applications are taking over 3 months before they approved.
You also need to set up learnership programs and reduce the powers of Cosatu.It is because of Cosatu that youngsters can't get a job easily because almost every employer now ask for a minimum of 2 years experience.How are young saffers who have just graduated going to get that 2 years experience without being employed?
There are many thing you guys can do to change the nation for the better but greed ,nepotism and this "No thanks,i know everything attitude" is what is slowly destroying a country that was once every African's pride and joy.You guys are all talk but no action. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
PatrickPM
Yet the government wants to pass on the law(smacking your own child is a crime), this will further throw our children into their own-self abuse; this is absurd and criminal. I don't think that some of these ministers have got kids. Now 12year old have raped. Cadre deployment has killed our society and politics. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Tabza325is
Sbu is telling us something we already know, SA jails are packed with young black men, we already know this and again solutions will be discussed but will bare no fruits. As a country we already know what needs to be done and we fail all the time in implimenting whatever plan of action, Sbu you should have kept quite and stayed in you office as you talk wont make any defference in our life time, maybe 100 years from know thing will start to change... Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
20fallguy
The department of correctional services is not helping the situation.there is a number of qualified people who have studied corrections(the core business of the department) which include the rehabiltation of these youths.but we are being systematically sidelined by the same crying Ndebela.mostly to be noted:the department is understaffed,overcrowded in almost all the centres but they won't hire us,people with qujalification.as they would say;we are only interested or recruiting the matriculants.A guy in mpumalanga was a taxi driver last year,now he is unit manager.what does he know about being a unit manager?and many of them in the department...are simply clueless of what should be their daily responsibilities.like we use to go there in search of information for our assigments,one word, disastarous.on paper the same crying Ndebela speaks of professionalisation of the DCS but in practice,its business as usually.WE SHALL CONTINUE TO HOPE FOR A BETTER FUTURE. Report Abuse
A little while ago, I had the fortune of being able to go and visit the village where I grew up. One of the elders put all our troubles down to 'lack of manners'. She pointed out that Africa (in general) is a passionate place with people who have short tempers. That is why were always so polite to each other (kept the bloodshed down). Now, nobody is polite any more. A child thinks they can insult an older person for no reason and they think they can speak to an older person in the same way they speak to their friends. Nobody seems to feel that greeting a person correctly is necessary and everybody seems to think that their 'rights' are more important than anybody else's 'rights'. In short, we have become rude and self centred. Maybe she was right? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
@MommaC
What happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?
As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies
**************************************************************************************************
Good morning MommaC
Democracy and rights (for everything) has taken that away. Neighbourhood eelders were able to discipline each other kids but if you were to do it now, you will be arrested for child abuse. Elders cannot even chastise the young ones as they will either be verbally or physically attacked.......... Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
*&%^& stupid idea.
Children are children and adults are adults. That is the law of nature and going against it is asking for trouble Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Warren
Momma C
The elder was absolutely right in her view of how general values and norms in most communities have changed. The big question is how and why did it change and when was the drastic change?
Remember that the youth we are talking about today are the future elders of those villages themselves.
What values do we expect in those villages in future?
The word to sum it all up is...Moral degenaration and those youth are currently not in a state of mind to fight it because to them its seen as "cool' today. I think you were able to experience the better old days that you were refering to because the adults before those days made sure that they controlled the rot that is moral degenertion,from the language a youth could use to what foreign influences they allowed their kids to be exposed to.
Thats why we,as today's adults, must fight every form of moral degeneration in our midst so that we can live with our conscience in future. To keep quite and act as if everything is normal in the middle of things like the current foreign drug onslaught,is to fail our youth when our elders then did not fail us.. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Warren
Isn't that a scary thought. I can't even begin to wonder what the kids 30 years from now will be like if the current generation are the wardens of their morality! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
'Youth' ages 18 - 35. I would be surprised if the prisons were filled with the middle aged.
@MommaC and Warren
I don't know where you all grew up but i can't imagine a south africa without a generation of bloodshed! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
That is sad :(
When I was a kid, old folk and children were sacrosanct. Nobody would ever even think of hurting them. The only bloodshed was when two people disagreed and someone came out with a bloody nose - they then went off for a drink together and the problem was solved.
I'm not saying there wasn't crime or evil deeds done but it certainly was not even vaguely on the level that we see today. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
online~Evangelist
This world is forever taking a route to damnation, Take heed the end is nigh
Jesus is coming, Repent and be counted worthy to escape the fire to come.
God is calling us to His kingdom (just like in the times of Noah so it will be in this age) REPENT Oh' children of God
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
Growing up you are protected from the worst, taught respect and adherence. You are pretty much taught what your parents want you to learn. The community at large teaches you the way of the world and you learn how to find your way in it.
Everyone is taught pretty much the same things but the community at large has changed and we adapt or become victims. Every person has the right to self determination and the consequences that flow from it!!
What do you consider respect??? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
BlackSeed
"We need to accept that crime and criminality is entirely about failures in society and not a direct consequence of the failures of the system of corrections," he said.
Well said and true
The opportunities for growth that our children get access to - Here you are lying Sir. Most of those that get these opportunities are living in better conditions Sir, unless they chose to go astray themselves; the poor still remains.
"The fact that these children, as young as 17 years of age, have committed serious crimes, should make society question where we have failed in protecting our children from a life of crime," he said. – Most of them come from an already destructed lineage Sir. How do you expect a broken family to raise a better and clean youth? Not all of them will prosper.
POVERTY is a crime against Humanity Sir – society needs to raise caring individuals and move away from it’s not my business mindset.
If you Teach a teacher nonsense, he or she will teach nonsense to the his or her current generation
LOL
I can just see it. Unfortunately (or fortunately), I grew up in quite a smallish community. My mother would know exactly what I had done and who I had been with before I even got home. Some days I could have quite happily strangled Ouma Kekklebek :) Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
That is partly why children shouldn't be having children. A 15 year old has no life experience or patience to groom a child into a healthy adult.
Respect (as I was taught) begins with yourself and extends outwards. You don't have to do what an elder tells you to but you do have to acknowledge that they have a greater life experience and to seriously consider their words. You don't call your parents or teachers rude names and you don't swear at people. Everyone gets the benefit of the doubt and you assume that they are worthy of respect until you are conclusively proven otherwise (not the other way around) Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Tasto
Blame apartheid Sbu not anc broer abt the bornfree in jails !! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Warren
Momma C
Isn't that a scary thought. I can't even begin to wonder what the kids 30 years from now will be like if the current generation are the wardens of their morality!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So scary you would hope to still be around then or at least be a fly on the wall just to observe how our country will be like then. The only problem is the sense of regret that one might feel for not having done more to protect our youth and our country.
Moffdat
'Youth' ages 18 - 35. I would be surprised if the prisons were filled with the middle aged.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
It is the percentage of that youth whose criminal acts were directly influenced by drugs in one way or another,which is where S.A. is failing them.
S.A. failing them includes every adult today who ignores the chemical (drugs)and moral onslaught that is facing our youth today.
Ms KinkyakaKamaSutra
It is sad and very worrying........
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively
-----------------------------------------------
LOL! I enjoyed reading this. Funny indeed. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
For as long as i've known teenagers and young adults will always be the ones to test unchartered waters.
This is where the statement common sense is not so common finds it's ultimate truth.
If you contest egos with young people you will always consider them disrespectfull blind to the fact that this is their societal duty. TO SINK OR SWIM!!!! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
MommaC
Evidently trying to be impartial and more open minded has made us ANC sympathizers and all we want to do here is make friends or so say Sinudeity. Try be more positive about SA and the DA supporters not the ANC supporters jump on you an accuse you of being narrow minded.... I give up.... Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
Warren
Ms KinkyakaKamaSutra
It is sad and very worrying........
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively
-----------------------------------------------
LOL! I enjoyed reading this. Funny indeed.
____________________________________________
So this is your idea of being respectful!!! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
Children start testing boundariies from when they are a mattter of weeks o1d. If the boundariies move then they push harrder and harrder. If the boundariies are always in the exact same place then they don't even bother testiing them any more. That goes from a tiny baby using cryiing to get atttention to an ado1escent teen using bad behaviiour to get attentiion. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
zululand
it pains me to admite this,our government is useless, our youth are useless , aftet 18 years we can not produce proper athletes in this country , but we seem to produce more babies and alcoholics , we can not blame white people for that. black people have a poor work ethic, extreme love of pleasure , ease and relaxation and that is a recipe for disaster. if black people want a share of this white own econmy , then they should wake up, work harder and stop misleading each other.
i work with a bunch of young black youth who have the potential to start businesses and grow themselves , but they choose to drink them self to obscuriy and chase after woman and get everthing else that come with it , including hiv and babies. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
LOL
I saw that.
I don't suppose it would do any good to point out the irony of calling people 'sheeple' when they are ANC and not recognising the same traits in their own comments
Thank the gods that I have not sold my soul to become a party political slave. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
It's nonsensical to believe your way is the right way, which is what the older generation do. Children will eluminate your flaws, expressly or tacitly it's not being disrespectful it's common sense. The evils in your personality that you didn't deal with when you had the chance is what you pass on to your children and that is what they will subconsciously fight the most!! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
MommaC
Can I join this discussion as the other has clearly gone South.
MommaC + Moffdat
My friend does his paper on taking risk and it is normally found that youth take more risk than those of advance ages as they do not have as much to lose, but in the end it is to take risk without pushing boundaries that is the problem in my opinion and it starts by knowing the boundaries that are set by society. Moffdat will understand the concept of common law and you must be taught these fundamentals at a young age it might be that these youths who break the law has never been taught these things or might I be wrong? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
BlackSeed
After all the Prison system itself took away a very important responsibility in disciplining the children by the Parents and the communities they live in. No one wants to be an outcast; if these children were raised well by both their parents and surrounding community members, things like this would not happen because where will these children go after defying the communities they live in?
Obviously the above scenario can ONLY work in communities that know no discrimination and reign with Love.
Depending on Governments/Politicians to change the mindsets of communities is an illusion.
Besides being labeled as criminals because of their living conditions, a so called illiterate beggar would behave better than an educated person because they are not taught to be arrogant. His/her condition would have taught him/her to be considerate.
At least he’s not being taught like the so called middle class and elite into believing that others are just lazy hence they could not get to where they are – that is the beginning of arrogance and egocentricity.
Education is the key to employment whilst Love is to a better life and harmony
Respect is not only how you conduct yourself but also how you relate to others. My parents were old school and we were taught from a young age about respect, humility (not only to family members but even the community at large). In the same token resepect is earned.
Moffdat
I agree that what bothers us most in others (be they young or old) are flaws that we have within ourselves. That is why my original question was about the 'village to raise a child'. Those bad traits are wattered down when they are combined within a society which has a more widely varied social norm. i.e. your dad may be quick with his fists but the kids see that most other dads are not so the common norm becomes the standard and your dad becomes the outlier. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
My generation was the ones who tested the boundaries of social norms to the absolute limits. That didn't change the overall requirement for respect for oneself and for others. If anything, the Hippie Generation was even more about respect (okay, so maybe not so lots for the law but we all know the law is an a$$ most of the time anyhow:)) Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
Yes but according to you what is respect. Is it not kissing your girlfriend in front of your neighbour like you mentioned earlier. Is it doing as you're told. Is it not responding to the elderly (as you mentioned earlier)? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
MommaC
This is what I do not understand look at that movement of peaceful demonstration right. There was drugs there was sex it was an epic party and it defined a generation forever with the simple word of "cool". Why can we not have such a thing again? Is it a mentality issue? I for one think its education as I always said it was, but we need to get away from this violence culture.
I have a sister and there is 10 years between us and you can clearly see in her the difference a simple generation can have. She was bought up when hidings were not PC so rarely got one. She is a bit more defiant then us when it comes to testing the water but it can not be set only on a simple thing such as getting a hiding? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
pierre2012
@Kaylae
We just need harsh sentences here in SA.other countries crime is less cause of the consequences but what does SA do feed,educate and house them
------------------------------------------
I agree with you. The laws in Mzansi are too "soft' on criminals. The laws have to be changed if the rate of crime is to go down. Mzansi is like a pardise for crimanals!!! They come from all over the world and when they mix with local criminals its the good law-abiding citizens who suffer!!! Maybe Mzansi needs to borrow a leaf from the Gambian "crazy man" who has vowed to ha.ng of those who were sentenced to de.ath by October!! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
Moffdat
I always found the cultural differences in respect of respect an interesting point. When for example I heard that in a black culture it is rude to look an elder directly in the eyes but then in our culture if you don't it is seen as dishonesty, but you are right in the end it is doing as you are told that will make all the difference. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
M'Lungu
Hau! It takes a village to raise a child? Not a "village idiot"? I know a lot of young Black men who grew up in absolute poverty, in constant political conflict, the worst Apartheid Education could throw at them - yet they are successful and proud members of the New South Africa - they are not sitting in the sun sniffing glue and scratching their body orrifices whilst waiting for people like the Woodworking Limpopo Loafer to deliver on Pie in the Sky Nationalisation promises and more " mahala" hand -outs! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
M'Lungu
The reverse is also true you get guys from affluent white families who despite their well upbringing snap and do something out of the norm. I think those few from both sides of the coins are outliers in themselves. I applaud all and any that can come out of degradation and make a name for him or herself Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
LOL
Dr Spock :) That man's books screwed up an entire group of kids. Parent's would have been better off listening to the Spock from Star Trek for parental advice.
I once read a theory about how it goes in cycles. The need to be opposite to what your parents are (or something like that) which gives alternations between rebellion and conformity. If the escalation in rebellious behaviour is anything to go by, the next generation will be positively victorian :)
My children would be the most docile little juppy brats ever. I want naughty kids. Can't wait to have a son because you can be a boy again with your boy. hahah I've never been an advocate for self help books, it always seems that the author always feels that their unique perspective will work on every human. A very good book to read at the moment about parenting and it's not a self help is battle hymn of the tiger mother talking about how different the upbringing is in respects to eastern and western philosophies. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
The traditional way of raising children is flawed. The old views are outdated and very dangerous.
We need to take a look at the most basic human concepts with regard to respect and reverance!
Allowing a stranger the same courteousy i extend to my parents just because he is older is mindless!!!! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Tasto
What is the colour of this youth by the way? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
I once read a theory about how it goes in cycles. The need to be opposite to what your parents are (or something like that) which gives alternations between rebellion and conformity. If the escalation in rebellious behaviour is anything to go by, the next generation will be positively victorian :)
_______________________________________________________
socrates and plato considered man a 'zoon politica' - animal of politics. Meaning our actions are dependant on social norms and achieving affluence amongst our peers. according to them this is what drives human action or inaction.
I DISAGREE, i believe man is a 'zoon progression' - animal of progression. We do what we must to progress. That's why we look at how we calibrate respect Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
That tigermom is a SCARY character.
Kids are all different, They are individual little creatures with their own buttons so having a one-size-fits-all is never going to work.
I must admit, a son is a wonderful thing to have. They make you go grey and they make you question Darwin but they are never boring :) Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
STOPA
you must blame the constitution that says a child has a right to report their parents to the police as and when they are disciplined for their unbecoming acts, you ran at 100metre speed to drive our people to fully inherit the western lifestyles, forgeting that we have our own culture to promote and develop. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
MommaC
I make myself question Darwin so think my son and I will be good mates. Hahah it's like a mini-me I just can't wait, but back to topic...
I don't know if the traditional way of raising children is wrong or if the understanding of the tradition is wrong. What I do know is that a child who is not instilled with respect for themselves is not likely to respect anyone else.
Kids do the opposite of what they are told to do because it makes them look 'cool' in the eyes of their peers. I think that is where the theory comes from. We didn't steal Old Man Gray's peaches because we were hungry or because our own yards didn't have peach trees, we stole them because it was dangerous (he had a shotgun with salt pellets in it), fun and something our parents would not approve of - it was naughty so it was 'cool'. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
Was hidings in school such a bad thing? I only ever got one and was sure as hell not going to do it again? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
Was hidings in school such a bad thing? I only ever got one and was sure as hell not going to do it again?
... once again, it depends on the child. I had callouses on my behind by the time I finished junior school. All a hiding ever made me was stubborn. My sister, you just had to threaten a hiding and she caved. So hidings didn't do me any harm but they certainly didn't do me any good either. If you wanted me to obey a rule you had to first convince me of the logic behind the rule. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
RobinH
Daniel: That one differed from school to school and teacher to teacher. I was at a conservative Afrikaans medium school, and the bulk of the male teachers were undiluted sadists. We got caned for the smallest transgression. Six strokes that sometimes drew blood. One sadistic b@st@rd used one of those auto fanbelts with little teeth. Lower than the top 10 (in a class of 40 odd), and you were caned. Hair just touching your collar, you were caned. Spotted anywhere other than at home in the week without your blazer (in DURBAN!!!) and you were caned. By the time we got to what we called standard 8, caning had become so routine we no longer cared. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
Respect is very important true but look at some of the old school ways of raising children.
1.Hidings - they discipline your children yes but the subconscious lesson is harmful. The child is taught to be violent when they don't get their way and become frustrated.
2.Girls playing with girls and boys with boys - Creates prejudice and misunderstanding in the future. As a woman i'm sure you'll agree.
3.Teaching children to adhere to the instruction of their elders... in todays day and age. Really?
The list is endless but from someone who has been told how disrespectful he is everytime he tries progressing in life i really want to know what you consider to be disrespectful? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
MommaC
I was a weakling at primary school just look at me wrong and I caved. Wonder if there was studies done to see if it worked and on what type of child? Such studies can not be done anymore, but would be interesting to see. Some blame their deviant behavior on not having a father or such, but I find that it doesn't hold water. Is it maybe a lack of discipline that makes these kids turn to crime?
In my family you have my father and my aunt. My father got a scholarship to RAU and later got is doctorates at Bloem whilst he had an absent father, he claims that the lack of a father wanted him to work harder so that his kids does not have to be without one. His sister turned to drugs and got arrested and locked up for 9 years for possession claiming that it was because she had no father. Weird how it worked like that. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
RobinH
Ok I was in Afrikaans school and didn't get that, but that was also the end of apartheid so much has changed, but then again hasn't that toughened you up later as a man? My father always says that it is sad that national service was taken away as it taught you to be a man. Maybe we need it again? Not to fight "Die Rooi Gevaar" but to just create a better caliber of man? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
1.Hidings - There is a big difference between the occasional spanking on the bottom and a regular bludgeoning. I was subjected to both. Between both of my kids, you can count on one hand the number of hidings they got. It was never done in anger and it was only ever for extremely serious behaviour. I'd rather spank my child than have her/him NOT learn that running out into the road in front of a car is not allowed
.
2.Girls playing with girls and boys with boys - Didn't have that. I had brothers and sisters and everyone played with everyone else in the neighbourhood.
3.Teaching children to adhere to the instruction of their elders.- Never had that either. We were shouted at or hauled off to our mothers by strangers but only our parents or teachers could instruct us. That was known by the kids and the adults. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
*Girls playing with girls and boys with boys*
You can see I'm deprived when you read dirty things into a simple sentence.... Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
Yes but what do you consider disrespectful behaviour. Not the emotional teenager who need do provocation but in the youngster doing what he thinks is standing up for himself Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
RobinH
Moffdat: W.r.t. the belief that a parent who endured regular beating will be prone to violence, I have to disagree. As indicated above, we were rather brutally beaten at school, though seldom by my parents. My children (3 of them) are now well over 20 and I never once gave any of them a hiding. Yet they are extremely decent, functioning productive adults for whom I would do anything. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
People always blame their own decisions on something else when they don't work out. Dr Spock used to blame adult dysfunctional behaviour on potty training (no, don't laugh, he really did). I always tell my kids that they should be happy to have parents as it will give them something to complain about one day when they are in the shrink's office :)
I have seen kids from the model homes where mommy is stay at home little Ms Goodwife who is on the PTA. Daddy is role model dad material who spends the weekends helping the kids to learn to ride bicycles or builds tree houses...... kid ends up a junkie with more issues than you can shake a stick at
I have seen other kids from awful homes where mommy is drunk and can't be bothered, daddy is substituted by a string of 'uncles' ..... kid ends up the star of a scientific laboratory and opens a homeless shelter.
Wonder what the defining thing that these people have in common is? There must be something? Probably rebelling against the status quo? Its a very weird situational problem? There must be studies done into this affect? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
Standing up for yourself is always a good thing.
Let me give you an example.
The kids who live at the back of us are sweet. They are kids so their ball quite often comes over the wall. They will come around the block to the front gate and ask politely for their ball.
The kid on our right is a snot nosed little brat. Occasionally his ball will come into the yard. He stands by the wall and throws rocks at my dog (or onto our roof) until he gets my attention and then DEMANDS his ball back. If you mention that a 'please' would be nice, he starts swearing at you and threatening you.
Now which kid do you think I find more respectful? Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
RobinH
The subconscious lesson will always be there whether you are the instigator or the victim.
Either you become violent or learn to expect violence! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Danielrjvvuren
There have been tons of studies. They all seem to have different results.
Even the old nature vs nurture argument doesn't explain it
Its like those studies which show that you will die young if you smoke and drink and then the next day you have the oldest recorded living human telling you how they survive on a packet of Lexington filterless and a half bottle of Jack a day. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
MommaC
That example is self explanatory i think.
I also think our very african(everyone) ideas of respect do us no good and serve a degenerate people who want to do as they please and never be questioned! Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
RobinH
Moffdat> Well then I am an exception that proves your rule. Not sure of that logic, but I for one, as indicated, suffered violence from teachers all my school life, and now abhor the very notion. I do my battles with words. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
MommaC
Moffdat
I do agree that we have to move with the times and that cultural norms of a time when we wondered around in donkeycarts have to be updated. We have to be careful to make sure that some of the good aspects are preserved in some form though.
I grew up in a rather confused house. My dad was VERY afrikaans and my mom was SA english. Two totally different species. My dad's ideas were that you respected adults and my mom's ideas were that respect is earned. Somewhere in the middle is possibly the answer. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Danielrjvvuren
We must teach the new generation to be both responsible and responsive in each and every action they take. Calculate before doing something. Weight risk thoroughly before jumping in head first. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Mmmooohooo
How will you protect these things when they are NYAWUPE??????, just try will point your grave. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Moffdat
Thanks for your comments people. Enjoy the first day of spring!!!
We have a long way to go but i have no doubt that this nation will get there!!!
Has SA failed to protect its youth?No,Zuma failled Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
RobinH
Ciao Moffdat, Daniel, MommaC; It's been quite a fun day actually. Absurdity galore. Enjoy the weekend, though Spring appears quite a long way off here in CT. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
Oakgona
Sotuh Africa is finally reaping the results of the freedom. Apartheid was not good but at least parents and teachers had the opportunity to instill the morals in the kids and they also had some activities to do to take them away from crime.
We grew up knowing do's and don't by force. Nowadays the policy makers instead of focusing more of the policies which can empower kids until they become responsible adults, they focused more of disempowering the parents of directing their kids without replacing the discipline with anything.
The policy makers where supposed to come up with programmes which will benefit the children, e.g. when we grew up, we used to have arts and culture competitions including choral competitions, we used to do needle work, sewing etc and competed on those things.
In this era of Freedom, what is it that is available for our youth? nothing except free RDP houses, grants, jail for parents and teachers who might try to descipline their kids just to name few.
It is possible to keep this kids out of jail. If we can come up with activities which will challenge their minds, this poor kids will re-direct their energy to the right things.
I humbly request our government to allocate budget to finance this young kids to further their studies, to have activies in their communities after school and above all to reward good behaviour in the communities.
Departments should also work together. Department of Education, Sport, Arts and Culture, Safety and Security, Health and Social Development etc should work together if they really care about the youth of the country.
The Ministers and MEC should also forget about their self interests and plan together with junior officials.
Remember an english proverb which says "an idling mind is the devil's workshop". Really if the poor kid's energies can be channeled to their own benefit, really crime will be reduced.
It is easy to further your studies in jail than outside but if we can change that perception, really we will go somewhere as the country. Report Abuse
Aug 31, 2012
16-12-1838
It has been statistically proven that preventing unwanted pregnancies and therefore the birth of unwanted children, lowers the crime rate considerably. During the 90's, the main contributory factor that decreased (by over 50%) the rampant crime rate in New York City, was the relaxing of legislation controlling abortions in the 70's and 80's .
There are far too many feral children in this country and the govt's insistance on promoting dependence through grants, via their indirect encouragement of teenage pregnancies, only exacerbates the problem.
Although not the most popular or PC solution, birth control is the only realistic solution to an ever increasing predicament. This is not only applicable to S.Africa but the entire planet, after all - our resources (both natural and synthetic) are not infinite and the social pressures through overcrowding, compound this very real problem. Report Abuse
in truth , the attitude of our government towards growming our youth leaves a lot to be desired, in all honestly , our own black goverment is responsible for crippling the futur of this country.the education system is a mess, not one leaders is able to tell us , the direction they are taking this country in , they al just come into power get their fat pay check and leave nothing for the future generation but worse, they leave a huge mess up in goverment .
SA has also failed its citizens by appointing Sbu Ndebele as DCS minister.
I mean, this guy failed in the Tranport Dept. by agreeing to put tolls on Gauteng roads without consulting with the public. He was supposed to be placed somewhere in the Local Govt and not where he is but this is not surprise ngoba angumkhaya waka double headed shower man. What do you expect from him in the Dept that was once dupped the most corrupt depts in SA.
I will never forget the controversial statement he made when he was still the premier of KwaZulu-Natal. He once said on public radio that ''Black spend most of their recreational time having sex and drinking alcohol''
As for me, wena Sbu, you're the worst minister i've ever heard of in the history of our democracy. Report Abuse
If you feel a comment on the site does not meet our general comments guidelines (see below), you can report the comment.
Comments guidelines:
Comments should be relevant to the article or the thread of conversation
Comments should not make personal attacks
Comments should not use vulgar, discriminatory, obscene or abusive language
Once reported, we will review the complaint you have made and the reason for it.
We will then take any action we believe appropriate and is within our rights. Please refer to the Terms and Conditions which are agreed to when registering on Sowetan LIVE.
Comments
Danielrjvvuren
What happened here now? No more comments?Report Abuse
Kaylae
We just need harsh sentences here in SA.other countries crime is less cause of the consequences but what does SA do feed,educate and house themReport Abuse
Kaylae
DanielrjvvurenWhat happened here now? No more comments?
_______________________________________________
Yep Dan no more comments#shocked#
Report Abuse
MommaC
What happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
KaylaeIt doesn't take much to confuse me and for a second I thought I was being played for the fool? All my comment gone. hahah Oh Sowetan how we love thee....
Report Abuse
candilious
what happened to our comments huh?Report Abuse
RobinH
That was weird.Report Abuse
Mellow
Sowetan what's the point of commenting if you just gonna remove them comments eish I have a better solution for y'all just block comments on this story and save us all from your silly stuntsReport Abuse
Warren
I say S.A. did fail and is still failing to protect its youth from heartless foreign drug dealers and human traffickers by allowing an almost uncontrolled access to the country by all sorts of foreign undesirables. The massive wave of foreigners into the country should have been better planned for and neccesary measures put in place to protect our youth and other citizens from whatever negative influences it brings with it.
The youth in schools are now suddenly exposed to alien types of drugs and influences and those are directly to blame for more than fifty percent of young inmates in prison for crimes ranging from theft,robbery,murder e.t.c. The influence of drugs is always present in those crimes.
The gov. can implement some serious damage control by jacking up our Justice and Home Affairs functions.
As one of the options,we need designated special courts with specialized prosecutors and minimum sentence for all drug related offences and human trafficking to protect our youth and our communities from the foreign chemical/drug onslaught.
Report Abuse
CYBORICO
@Momma cit still takes a village to raise a kid, just that the villages r left with self centered adults who dont give a bf$%ck about others but themselves, just yersteday the same people were saying all loads of gabage on the article of that radio DJ who wanted to get closer to his family, when the rape cases get reported the same people talk K$k as if the rapist all emerged from the soil or from space
Report Abuse
Lehido
The youth must also play the part in protecting themselves......Report Abuse
MommaC
CYBORICOI'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
Where did those days go?
Report Abuse
CYBORICO
@LehidoThe youth must also play the part in protecting themselves
cum on now, youth need guidence, otherwise they always make the wrong desicions which at the time seem right to them. the youth always want to test the boundries and this can be costly at times.
Report Abuse
Warren
The case this week of a shoolkid selling drug laced muffins at school drives home the unfortunate truth that every single parent must know,whether they accept it or not,that their child has a 50/50 probability of becoming a drug addict just by merely attending school. As a parent,you can only do so much to protect your child from that exposure by warning them and talking to them,the rest still rests with the authorities who are mandated to stop and discourage those drugs from reaching our schools and communities. The police alone cant do that when the courts still treat drug offences just like any other crime with five hundred rands bail and normal sentences. The ease with which those foreign drug dealers also move around and reach our kids at school is a complete failure to protect our kids on the side of home affairs.@Momma C.
It takes a village to raise a child but if that village has a Nigerian drug dealer operating in it, it is no more that simple to raise that child when he or she has a strong craving for a drug fix.
In order to protect our youth,drug offences cant continue being handled in normal courts by the usual prosecutors and drug sentences cant continue being considered as ordinary crimes.
Report Abuse
CYBORICO
@MommacI'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
Where did those days go
I am in my early thrities but surely remember those days, the days when a motorist will stop his car and come out with a shambok just because we was playing soccer on the street, when adults will chase away young girls standing with boys in the corners of dusty old mzansi, i was there Momma but surely am not as matured as u sound but I am working on it
Report Abuse
QueenLuu
MommaCWhat happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?
As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies
###########################################
Children have rights in SA. Parents who spank their children could soon be slapped with criminal charges - if a children's rights lobby group gets its way so there's really very little a village can do.
Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
I say that SA has failed their youth under the anc. Firstly the anc has instilled a sense of entitlement and the belief that one must just take what one wants without having to work for it. Next they dumbed down the education system so that a matric now days is not worth the paper its printed on or is easily forged. Then you have certain 'youth leaders' who promote teen pregnancies and encourage it for the revolution??? The parents of these teen pregnancies drop out of school to look after their kids and many resort to prostitution to get money as they dont have skills or education to find decent jobs. Its a vicious cycle started by the anc and will continue until they are out voted!Report Abuse
TKay
Discipline starts at homeReport Abuse
MommaC
CYBORICOLOL
I can remember going to parties and when the Aunties decided it was getting late now, they'd come out (curlers and all) with brooms, mops and wooden spoons to chase us all home. If they tried to do that today, they'd probably get beaten up or shot, so I suppose it is understandable why they don't involve themselves any more. Those were good days though.
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
I will repeat my previous, no deleted, comment. There are institutions in place to help the youth, but these institutions or too busy having intra and inter organizational conflict and fighting over crap such as what is in the ground and the ground itself it is completely missing the youth problems. We need an organization that can stand for youth issues such as education and not wanting advancements of the organization itself and if you guys think I'm only talking about ANCYL no this statement includes the DA's allusive youth league tooReport Abuse
Warren
@Momma CI'm not sure how old you are but I remember the times when a tsotsi on the street would come across a school kid bunking and haul them off to school by the ear. A man would stop to watch a quarrel between a bunch of random kids - just to make sure it didn't get out of hand. A shabeen owner would take a shambok to a young kid trying to buy alcohol. A woman would stop to ask a young kid why they were crying and if they were okay.
Where did those days go?
----------------------------------------------------------------
Those days are certainly gone. How do you grab a child by the ear when he is high on drugs and so transformed that even his own parents and teachers are afraid to touch him?
Youth cant really be expected to protect themselves against those influences without the help of authorities who must and CAN make sure that most of those drugs do not reach our youth,especially at schools. That is why other countries have a straight death sentence to protect their youth and communities against drugs. Their countries are not drug dealers' paradise like we are becoming.
Report Abuse
QueenLuu
@TKay true and yet the government wants to take that away too.@DBN guy thats a very sad truth hey.
Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
QueenLuuIf this country had youth leaders that actually fought for the youth and issues affecting the youth then i am sure there would be far less going to jail and having kids while still a kid themselves. Yet we ahve youth leaders marching for nationalisation, displeasure with Limpopo being put under administration and the leadership of Botswana.
Report Abuse
9janavy
Mr Mininster,no Government in the world is perfect.The problem with yours is cadre deployment, instead of appointing people with experience and proper knowledge of their portfolio in top positions, you guys appoint relatives and friends even though some of them are ex-convicts.It is the worst kind of nepotism i have ever witnessed in any country in the world.Secondly you need to stop protecting big monopolistic cooperations like Telkom, Ackermans,HiFi cooperation e.t.c and give room for healthy competition.In the last two years you guys have messed up everything with your ridiculous laws.One time it used to take two weeks to register a CC now that you changed the law and mandated every one to register a Pty some applications are taking over 3 months before they approved.
You also need to set up learnership programs and reduce the powers of Cosatu.It is because of Cosatu that youngsters can't get a job easily because almost every employer now ask for a minimum of 2 years experience.How are young saffers who have just graduated going to get that 2 years experience without being employed?
There are many thing you guys can do to change the nation for the better but greed ,nepotism and this "No thanks,i know everything attitude" is what is slowly destroying a country that was once every African's pride and joy.You guys are all talk but no action.
Report Abuse
PatrickPM
Yet the government wants to pass on the law(smacking your own child is a crime), this will further throw our children into their own-self abuse; this is absurd and criminal. I don't think that some of these ministers have got kids. Now 12year old have raped. Cadre deployment has killed our society and politics.Report Abuse
Tabza325is
Sbu is telling us something we already know, SA jails are packed with young black men, we already know this and again solutions will be discussed but will bare no fruits. As a country we already know what needs to be done and we fail all the time in implimenting whatever plan of action, Sbu you should have kept quite and stayed in you office as you talk wont make any defference in our life time, maybe 100 years from know thing will start to change...Report Abuse
20fallguy
The department of correctional services is not helping the situation.there is a number of qualified people who have studied corrections(the core business of the department) which include the rehabiltation of these youths.but we are being systematically sidelined by the same crying Ndebela.mostly to be noted:the department is understaffed,overcrowded in almost all the centres but they won't hire us,people with qujalification.as they would say;we are only interested or recruiting the matriculants.A guy in mpumalanga was a taxi driver last year,now he is unit manager.what does he know about being a unit manager?and many of them in the department...are simply clueless of what should be their daily responsibilities.like we use to go there in search of information for our assigments,one word, disastarous.on paper the same crying Ndebela speaks of professionalisation of the DCS but in practice,its business as usually.WE SHALL CONTINUE TO HOPE FOR A BETTER FUTURE.Report Abuse
DA-DBN-GUY
9janavyWell said dude.
Report Abuse
MommaC
WarrenA little while ago, I had the fortune of being able to go and visit the village where I grew up. One of the elders put all our troubles down to 'lack of manners'. She pointed out that Africa (in general) is a passionate place with people who have short tempers. That is why were always so polite to each other (kept the bloodshed down). Now, nobody is polite any more. A child thinks they can insult an older person for no reason and they think they can speak to an older person in the same way they speak to their friends. Nobody seems to feel that greeting a person correctly is necessary and everybody seems to think that their 'rights' are more important than anybody else's 'rights'. In short, we have become rude and self centred. Maybe she was right?
Report Abuse
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
@MommaCWhat happened to the concept that 'it takes a village to raise a child'?
As adults, we should all hang our heads in shame.
Lord of the Flies
**************************************************************************************************
Good morning MommaC
Democracy and rights (for everything) has taken that away. Neighbourhood eelders were able to discipline each other kids but if you were to do it now, you will be arrested for child abuse. Elders cannot even chastise the young ones as they will either be verbally or physically attacked..........
Report Abuse
MommaC
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra*&%^& stupid idea.
Children are children and adults are adults. That is the law of nature and going against it is asking for trouble
Report Abuse
Warren
Momma CThe elder was absolutely right in her view of how general values and norms in most communities have changed. The big question is how and why did it change and when was the drastic change?
Remember that the youth we are talking about today are the future elders of those villages themselves.
What values do we expect in those villages in future?
The word to sum it all up is...Moral degenaration and those youth are currently not in a state of mind to fight it because to them its seen as "cool' today. I think you were able to experience the better old days that you were refering to because the adults before those days made sure that they controlled the rot that is moral degenertion,from the language a youth could use to what foreign influences they allowed their kids to be exposed to.
Thats why we,as today's adults, must fight every form of moral degeneration in our midst so that we can live with our conscience in future. To keep quite and act as if everything is normal in the middle of things like the current foreign drug onslaught,is to fail our youth when our elders then did not fail us..
Report Abuse
MommaC
WarrenIsn't that a scary thought. I can't even begin to wonder what the kids 30 years from now will be like if the current generation are the wardens of their morality!
Report Abuse
Moffdat
'Youth' ages 18 - 35. I would be surprised if the prisons were filled with the middle aged.@MommaC and Warren
I don't know where you all grew up but i can't imagine a south africa without a generation of bloodshed!
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatThat is sad :(
When I was a kid, old folk and children were sacrosanct. Nobody would ever even think of hurting them. The only bloodshed was when two people disagreed and someone came out with a bloody nose - they then went off for a drink together and the problem was solved.
I'm not saying there wasn't crime or evil deeds done but it certainly was not even vaguely on the level that we see today.
Report Abuse
online~Evangelist
This world is forever taking a route to damnation, Take heed the end is nighJesus is coming, Repent and be counted worthy to escape the fire to come.
God is calling us to His kingdom (just like in the times of Noah so it will be in this age) REPENT Oh' children of God
The preacher has spoken
Report Abuse
Tasto
Sbu Frankenstein Constitution broer - import from Dutch, Canada etc !Report Abuse
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
@MommaCIt is sad and very worrying........
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCGrowing up you are protected from the worst, taught respect and adherence. You are pretty much taught what your parents want you to learn. The community at large teaches you the way of the world and you learn how to find your way in it.
Everyone is taught pretty much the same things but the community at large has changed and we adapt or become victims. Every person has the right to self determination and the consequences that flow from it!!
What do you consider respect???
Report Abuse
BlackSeed
"We need to accept that crime and criminality is entirely about failures in society and not a direct consequence of the failures of the system of corrections," he said.Well said and true
The opportunities for growth that our children get access to - Here you are lying Sir. Most of those that get these opportunities are living in better conditions Sir, unless they chose to go astray themselves; the poor still remains.
"The fact that these children, as young as 17 years of age, have committed serious crimes, should make society question where we have failed in protecting our children from a life of crime," he said. – Most of them come from an already destructed lineage Sir. How do you expect a broken family to raise a better and clean youth? Not all of them will prosper.
POVERTY is a crime against Humanity Sir – society needs to raise caring individuals and move away from it’s not my business mindset.
If you Teach a teacher nonsense, he or she will teach nonsense to the his or her current generation
Report Abuse
MommaC
MsKinkyakaKamaSutraLOL
I can just see it. Unfortunately (or fortunately), I grew up in quite a smallish community. My mother would know exactly what I had done and who I had been with before I even got home. Some days I could have quite happily strangled Ouma Kekklebek :)
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatThat is partly why children shouldn't be having children. A 15 year old has no life experience or patience to groom a child into a healthy adult.
Respect (as I was taught) begins with yourself and extends outwards. You don't have to do what an elder tells you to but you do have to acknowledge that they have a greater life experience and to seriously consider their words. You don't call your parents or teachers rude names and you don't swear at people. Everyone gets the benefit of the doubt and you assume that they are worthy of respect until you are conclusively proven otherwise (not the other way around)
Report Abuse
Tasto
Blame apartheid Sbu not anc broer abt the bornfree in jails !!Report Abuse
Warren
Momma CIsn't that a scary thought. I can't even begin to wonder what the kids 30 years from now will be like if the current generation are the wardens of their morality!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So scary you would hope to still be around then or at least be a fly on the wall just to observe how our country will be like then. The only problem is the sense of regret that one might feel for not having done more to protect our youth and our country.
Moffdat
'Youth' ages 18 - 35. I would be surprised if the prisons were filled with the middle aged.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
It is the percentage of that youth whose criminal acts were directly influenced by drugs in one way or another,which is where S.A. is failing them.
S.A. failing them includes every adult today who ignores the chemical (drugs)and moral onslaught that is facing our youth today.
Report Abuse
Warren
Ms KinkyakaKamaSutraIt is sad and very worrying........
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively
-----------------------------------------------
LOL! I enjoyed reading this. Funny indeed.
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCFor as long as i've known teenagers and young adults will always be the ones to test unchartered waters.
This is where the statement common sense is not so common finds it's ultimate truth.
If you contest egos with young people you will always consider them disrespectfull blind to the fact that this is their societal duty. TO SINK OR SWIM!!!!
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCEvidently trying to be impartial and more open minded has made us ANC sympathizers and all we want to do here is make friends or so say Sinudeity. Try be more positive about SA and the DA supporters not the ANC supporters jump on you an accuse you of being narrow minded.... I give up....
Report Abuse
Moffdat
WarrenMs KinkyakaKamaSutra
It is sad and very worrying........
I also grew up in an environment where you respected an elder as your parent and never bac chat to them. I remember when I first started dating. One time I was strolling with the BF and saw one of my neighbours......... I ran for dear life, didnt even kiss he BF goodbye.........
In process left one of my sandals behind.,,, which I fetched after the dust has settled.......... literally and fuguritively
-----------------------------------------------
LOL! I enjoyed reading this. Funny indeed.
____________________________________________
So this is your idea of being respectful!!!
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatChildren start testing boundariies from when they are a mattter of weeks o1d. If the boundariies move then they push harrder and harrder. If the boundariies are always in the exact same place then they don't even bother testiing them any more. That goes from a tiny baby using cryiing to get atttention to an ado1escent teen using bad behaviiour to get attentiion.
Report Abuse
zululand
it pains me to admite this,our government is useless, our youth are useless , aftet 18 years we can not produce proper athletes in this country , but we seem to produce more babies and alcoholics , we can not blame white people for that. black people have a poor work ethic, extreme love of pleasure , ease and relaxation and that is a recipe for disaster. if black people want a share of this white own econmy , then they should wake up, work harder and stop misleading each other.i work with a bunch of young black youth who have the potential to start businesses and grow themselves , but they choose to drink them self to obscuriy and chase after woman and get everthing else that come with it , including hiv and babies.
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenLOL
I saw that.
I don't suppose it would do any good to point out the irony of calling people 'sheeple' when they are ANC and not recognising the same traits in their own comments
Thank the gods that I have not sold my soul to become a party political slave.
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCIt's nonsensical to believe your way is the right way, which is what the older generation do. Children will eluminate your flaws, expressly or tacitly it's not being disrespectful it's common sense. The evils in your personality that you didn't deal with when you had the chance is what you pass on to your children and that is what they will subconsciously fight the most!!
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCCan I join this discussion as the other has clearly gone South.
MommaC + Moffdat
My friend does his paper on taking risk and it is normally found that youth take more risk than those of advance ages as they do not have as much to lose, but in the end it is to take risk without pushing boundaries that is the problem in my opinion and it starts by knowing the boundaries that are set by society. Moffdat will understand the concept of common law and you must be taught these fundamentals at a young age it might be that these youths who break the law has never been taught these things or might I be wrong?
Report Abuse
BlackSeed
After all the Prison system itself took away a very important responsibility in disciplining the children by the Parents and the communities they live in. No one wants to be an outcast; if these children were raised well by both their parents and surrounding community members, things like this would not happen because where will these children go after defying the communities they live in?Obviously the above scenario can ONLY work in communities that know no discrimination and reign with Love.
Depending on Governments/Politicians to change the mindsets of communities is an illusion.
Besides being labeled as criminals because of their living conditions, a so called illiterate beggar would behave better than an educated person because they are not taught to be arrogant. His/her condition would have taught him/her to be considerate.
At least he’s not being taught like the so called middle class and elite into believing that others are just lazy hence they could not get to where they are – that is the beginning of arrogance and egocentricity.
Education is the key to employment whilst Love is to a better life and harmony
Report Abuse
MsKinkyakaKamaSutra
@MoffdatRespect is not only how you conduct yourself but also how you relate to others. My parents were old school and we were taught from a young age about respect, humility (not only to family members but even the community at large). In the same token resepect is earned.
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenWelcome aboard the good ship 'not political' :)
Moffdat
I agree that what bothers us most in others (be they young or old) are flaws that we have within ourselves. That is why my original question was about the 'village to raise a child'. Those bad traits are wattered down when they are combined within a society which has a more widely varied social norm. i.e. your dad may be quick with his fists but the kids see that most other dads are not so the common norm becomes the standard and your dad becomes the outlier.
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenMy generation was the ones who tested the boundaries of social norms to the absolute limits. That didn't change the overall requirement for respect for oneself and for others. If anything, the Hippie Generation was even more about respect (okay, so maybe not so lots for the law but we all know the law is an a$$ most of the time anyhow:))
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MsKinkyakaKamaSutraYes but according to you what is respect. Is it not kissing your girlfriend in front of your neighbour like you mentioned earlier. Is it doing as you're told. Is it not responding to the elderly (as you mentioned earlier)?
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCThis is what I do not understand look at that movement of peaceful demonstration right. There was drugs there was sex it was an epic party and it defined a generation forever with the simple word of "cool". Why can we not have such a thing again? Is it a mentality issue? I for one think its education as I always said it was, but we need to get away from this violence culture.
I have a sister and there is 10 years between us and you can clearly see in her the difference a simple generation can have. She was bought up when hidings were not PC so rarely got one. She is a bit more defiant then us when it comes to testing the water but it can not be set only on a simple thing such as getting a hiding?
Report Abuse
pierre2012
@KaylaeWe just need harsh sentences here in SA.other countries crime is less cause of the consequences but what does SA do feed,educate and house them
------------------------------------------
I agree with you. The laws in Mzansi are too "soft' on criminals. The laws have to be changed if the rate of crime is to go down. Mzansi is like a pardise for crimanals!!! They come from all over the world and when they mix with local criminals its the good law-abiding citizens who suffer!!! Maybe Mzansi needs to borrow a leaf from the Gambian "crazy man" who has vowed to ha.ng of those who were sentenced to de.ath by October!!
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MoffdatI always found the cultural differences in respect of respect an interesting point. When for example I heard that in a black culture it is rude to look an elder directly in the eyes but then in our culture if you don't it is seen as dishonesty, but you are right in the end it is doing as you are told that will make all the difference.
Report Abuse
M'Lungu
Hau! It takes a village to raise a child? Not a "village idiot"? I know a lot of young Black men who grew up in absolute poverty, in constant political conflict, the worst Apartheid Education could throw at them - yet they are successful and proud members of the New South Africa - they are not sitting in the sun sniffing glue and scratching their body orrifices whilst waiting for people like the Woodworking Limpopo Loafer to deliver on Pie in the Sky Nationalisation promises and more " mahala" hand -outs!Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
M'LunguThe reverse is also true you get guys from affluent white families who despite their well upbringing snap and do something out of the norm. I think those few from both sides of the coins are outliers in themselves. I applaud all and any that can come out of degradation and make a name for him or herself
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenLOL
Dr Spock :) That man's books screwed up an entire group of kids. Parent's would have been better off listening to the Spock from Star Trek for parental advice.
I once read a theory about how it goes in cycles. The need to be opposite to what your parents are (or something like that) which gives alternations between rebellion and conformity. If the escalation in rebellious behaviour is anything to go by, the next generation will be positively victorian :)
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCMy children would be the most docile little juppy brats ever. I want naughty kids. Can't wait to have a son because you can be a boy again with your boy. hahah I've never been an advocate for self help books, it always seems that the author always feels that their unique perspective will work on every human. A very good book to read at the moment about parenting and it's not a self help is battle hymn of the tiger mother talking about how different the upbringing is in respects to eastern and western philosophies.
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCThe traditional way of raising children is flawed. The old views are outdated and very dangerous.
We need to take a look at the most basic human concepts with regard to respect and reverance!
Allowing a stranger the same courteousy i extend to my parents just because he is older is mindless!!!!
Report Abuse
Tasto
What is the colour of this youth by the way?Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCI once read a theory about how it goes in cycles. The need to be opposite to what your parents are (or something like that) which gives alternations between rebellion and conformity. If the escalation in rebellious behaviour is anything to go by, the next generation will be positively victorian :)
_______________________________________________________
socrates and plato considered man a 'zoon politica' - animal of politics. Meaning our actions are dependant on social norms and achieving affluence amongst our peers. according to them this is what drives human action or inaction.
I DISAGREE, i believe man is a 'zoon progression' - animal of progression. We do what we must to progress. That's why we look at how we calibrate respect
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenThat tigermom is a SCARY character.
Kids are all different, They are individual little creatures with their own buttons so having a one-size-fits-all is never going to work.
I must admit, a son is a wonderful thing to have. They make you go grey and they make you question Darwin but they are never boring :)
Report Abuse
STOPA
you must blame the constitution that says a child has a right to report their parents to the police as and when they are disciplined for their unbecoming acts, you ran at 100metre speed to drive our people to fully inherit the western lifestyles, forgeting that we have our own culture to promote and develop.Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCI make myself question Darwin so think my son and I will be good mates. Hahah it's like a mini-me I just can't wait, but back to topic...
Whats the topic?
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatI don't know if the traditional way of raising children is wrong or if the understanding of the tradition is wrong. What I do know is that a child who is not instilled with respect for themselves is not likely to respect anyone else.
Kids do the opposite of what they are told to do because it makes them look 'cool' in the eyes of their peers. I think that is where the theory comes from. We didn't steal Old Man Gray's peaches because we were hungry or because our own yards didn't have peach trees, we stole them because it was dangerous (he had a shotgun with salt pellets in it), fun and something our parents would not approve of - it was naughty so it was 'cool'.
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
Was hidings in school such a bad thing? I only ever got one and was sure as hell not going to do it again?Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenWas hidings in school such a bad thing? I only ever got one and was sure as hell not going to do it again?
... once again, it depends on the child. I had callouses on my behind by the time I finished junior school. All a hiding ever made me was stubborn. My sister, you just had to threaten a hiding and she caved. So hidings didn't do me any harm but they certainly didn't do me any good either. If you wanted me to obey a rule you had to first convince me of the logic behind the rule.
Report Abuse
RobinH
Daniel: That one differed from school to school and teacher to teacher. I was at a conservative Afrikaans medium school, and the bulk of the male teachers were undiluted sadists. We got caned for the smallest transgression. Six strokes that sometimes drew blood. One sadistic b@st@rd used one of those auto fanbelts with little teeth. Lower than the top 10 (in a class of 40 odd), and you were caned. Hair just touching your collar, you were caned. Spotted anywhere other than at home in the week without your blazer (in DURBAN!!!) and you were caned. By the time we got to what we called standard 8, caning had become so routine we no longer cared.Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCRespect is very important true but look at some of the old school ways of raising children.
1.Hidings - they discipline your children yes but the subconscious lesson is harmful. The child is taught to be violent when they don't get their way and become frustrated.
2.Girls playing with girls and boys with boys - Creates prejudice and misunderstanding in the future. As a woman i'm sure you'll agree.
3.Teaching children to adhere to the instruction of their elders... in todays day and age. Really?
The list is endless but from someone who has been told how disrespectful he is everytime he tries progressing in life i really want to know what you consider to be disrespectful?
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCI was a weakling at primary school just look at me wrong and I caved. Wonder if there was studies done to see if it worked and on what type of child? Such studies can not be done anymore, but would be interesting to see. Some blame their deviant behavior on not having a father or such, but I find that it doesn't hold water. Is it maybe a lack of discipline that makes these kids turn to crime?
In my family you have my father and my aunt. My father got a scholarship to RAU and later got is doctorates at Bloem whilst he had an absent father, he claims that the lack of a father wanted him to work harder so that his kids does not have to be without one. His sister turned to drugs and got arrested and locked up for 9 years for possession claiming that it was because she had no father. Weird how it worked like that.
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
RobinHOk I was in Afrikaans school and didn't get that, but that was also the end of apartheid so much has changed, but then again hasn't that toughened you up later as a man? My father always says that it is sad that national service was taken away as it taught you to be a man. Maybe we need it again? Not to fight "Die Rooi Gevaar" but to just create a better caliber of man?
Report Abuse
MommaC
Moffdat1.Hidings - There is a big difference between the occasional spanking on the bottom and a regular bludgeoning. I was subjected to both. Between both of my kids, you can count on one hand the number of hidings they got. It was never done in anger and it was only ever for extremely serious behaviour. I'd rather spank my child than have her/him NOT learn that running out into the road in front of a car is not allowed
.
2.Girls playing with girls and boys with boys - Didn't have that. I had brothers and sisters and everyone played with everyone else in the neighbourhood.
3.Teaching children to adhere to the instruction of their elders.- Never had that either. We were shouted at or hauled off to our mothers by strangers but only our parents or teachers could instruct us. That was known by the kids and the adults.
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
*Girls playing with girls and boys with boys*You can see I'm deprived when you read dirty things into a simple sentence....
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCYes but what do you consider disrespectful behaviour. Not the emotional teenager who need do provocation but in the youngster doing what he thinks is standing up for himself
Report Abuse
RobinH
Moffdat: W.r.t. the belief that a parent who endured regular beating will be prone to violence, I have to disagree. As indicated above, we were rather brutally beaten at school, though seldom by my parents. My children (3 of them) are now well over 20 and I never once gave any of them a hiding. Yet they are extremely decent, functioning productive adults for whom I would do anything.Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenPeople always blame their own decisions on something else when they don't work out. Dr Spock used to blame adult dysfunctional behaviour on potty training (no, don't laugh, he really did). I always tell my kids that they should be happy to have parents as it will give them something to complain about one day when they are in the shrink's office :)
I have seen kids from the model homes where mommy is stay at home little Ms Goodwife who is on the PTA. Daddy is role model dad material who spends the weekends helping the kids to learn to ride bicycles or builds tree houses...... kid ends up a junkie with more issues than you can shake a stick at
I have seen other kids from awful homes where mommy is drunk and can't be bothered, daddy is substituted by a string of 'uncles' ..... kid ends up the star of a scientific laboratory and opens a homeless shelter.
Go figure
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MommaCWonder what the defining thing that these people have in common is? There must be something? Probably rebelling against the status quo? Its a very weird situational problem? There must be studies done into this affect?
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatStanding up for yourself is always a good thing.
Let me give you an example.
The kids who live at the back of us are sweet. They are kids so their ball quite often comes over the wall. They will come around the block to the front gate and ask politely for their ball.
The kid on our right is a snot nosed little brat. Occasionally his ball will come into the yard. He stands by the wall and throws rocks at my dog (or onto our roof) until he gets my attention and then DEMANDS his ball back. If you mention that a 'please' would be nice, he starts swearing at you and threatening you.
Now which kid do you think I find more respectful?
Report Abuse
Moffdat
RobinHThe subconscious lesson will always be there whether you are the instigator or the victim.
Either you become violent or learn to expect violence!
Report Abuse
MommaC
DanielrjvvurenThere have been tons of studies. They all seem to have different results.
Even the old nature vs nurture argument doesn't explain it
Its like those studies which show that you will die young if you smoke and drink and then the next day you have the oldest recorded living human telling you how they survive on a packet of Lexington filterless and a half bottle of Jack a day.
Report Abuse
Moffdat
MommaCThat example is self explanatory i think.
I also think our very african(everyone) ideas of respect do us no good and serve a degenerate people who want to do as they please and never be questioned!
Report Abuse
RobinH
Moffdat> Well then I am an exception that proves your rule. Not sure of that logic, but I for one, as indicated, suffered violence from teachers all my school life, and now abhor the very notion. I do my battles with words.Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatI do agree that we have to move with the times and that cultural norms of a time when we wondered around in donkeycarts have to be updated. We have to be careful to make sure that some of the good aspects are preserved in some form though.
I grew up in a rather confused house. My dad was VERY afrikaans and my mom was SA english. Two totally different species. My dad's ideas were that you respected adults and my mom's ideas were that respect is earned. Somewhere in the middle is possibly the answer.
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
We must teach the new generation to be both responsible and responsive in each and every action they take. Calculate before doing something. Weight risk thoroughly before jumping in head first.Report Abuse
Mmmooohooo
How will you protect these things when they are NYAWUPE??????, just try will point your grave.Report Abuse
Moffdat
Thanks for your comments people. Enjoy the first day of spring!!!We have a long way to go but i have no doubt that this nation will get there!!!
____________________logging out_________________
Report Abuse
Danielrjvvuren
MoffdatYou didn't comment once on my comments! hahah geniet boet! Be good or bad or just be safe ok!
Report Abuse
MommaC
MoffdatBe safe and have a great weekend :)
Report Abuse
Pitso.MCCMA.SAFA
Has SA failed to protect its youth?No,Zuma failledReport Abuse
RobinH
Ciao Moffdat, Daniel, MommaC; It's been quite a fun day actually. Absurdity galore. Enjoy the weekend, though Spring appears quite a long way off here in CT.Report Abuse
Oakgona
Sotuh Africa is finally reaping the results of the freedom. Apartheid was not good but at least parents and teachers had the opportunity to instill the morals in the kids and they also had some activities to do to take them away from crime.We grew up knowing do's and don't by force. Nowadays the policy makers instead of focusing more of the policies which can empower kids until they become responsible adults, they focused more of disempowering the parents of directing their kids without replacing the discipline with anything.
The policy makers where supposed to come up with programmes which will benefit the children, e.g. when we grew up, we used to have arts and culture competitions including choral competitions, we used to do needle work, sewing etc and competed on those things.
In this era of Freedom, what is it that is available for our youth? nothing except free RDP houses, grants, jail for parents and teachers who might try to descipline their kids just to name few.
It is possible to keep this kids out of jail. If we can come up with activities which will challenge their minds, this poor kids will re-direct their energy to the right things.
I humbly request our government to allocate budget to finance this young kids to further their studies, to have activies in their communities after school and above all to reward good behaviour in the communities.
Report Abuse
Oakgona
Departments should also work together. Department of Education, Sport, Arts and Culture, Safety and Security, Health and Social Development etc should work together if they really care about the youth of the country.The Ministers and MEC should also forget about their self interests and plan together with junior officials.
Remember an english proverb which says "an idling mind is the devil's workshop". Really if the poor kid's energies can be channeled to their own benefit, really crime will be reduced.
It is easy to further your studies in jail than outside but if we can change that perception, really we will go somewhere as the country.
Report Abuse
16-12-1838
It has been statistically proven that preventing unwanted pregnancies and therefore the birth of unwanted children, lowers the crime rate considerably. During the 90's, the main contributory factor that decreased (by over 50%) the rampant crime rate in New York City, was the relaxing of legislation controlling abortions in the 70's and 80's .There are far too many feral children in this country and the govt's insistance on promoting dependence through grants, via their indirect encouragement of teenage pregnancies, only exacerbates the problem.
Although not the most popular or PC solution, birth control is the only realistic solution to an ever increasing predicament. This is not only applicable to S.Africa but the entire planet, after all - our resources (both natural and synthetic) are not infinite and the social pressures through overcrowding, compound this very real problem.
Report Abuse
dbongziTOE
Come to SA, it happening!!!Report Abuse
zululand
in truth , the attitude of our government towards growming our youth leaves a lot to be desired, in all honestly , our own black goverment is responsible for crippling the futur of this country.the education system is a mess, not one leaders is able to tell us , the direction they are taking this country in , they al just come into power get their fat pay check and leave nothing for the future generation but worse, they leave a huge mess up in goverment .Report Abuse
Majamela
SA has also failed its citizens by appointing Sbu Ndebele as DCS minister.I mean, this guy failed in the Tranport Dept. by agreeing to put tolls on Gauteng roads without consulting with the public. He was supposed to be placed somewhere in the Local Govt and not where he is but this is not surprise ngoba angumkhaya waka double headed shower man. What do you expect from him in the Dept that was once dupped the most corrupt depts in SA.
I will never forget the controversial statement he made when he was still the premier of KwaZulu-Natal. He once said on public radio that ''Black spend most of their recreational time having sex and drinking alcohol''
As for me, wena Sbu, you're the worst minister i've ever heard of in the history of our democracy.
Report Abuse
Read all 103 comments